CODE/DESIGN: Building & Wonder flag limit removal

[epeterson]

Roger that MrBaggins! Sorry about the trouble in bringing me up to speed guys.

So, is the first part of my first post still applicable??

I think that if you destroy a wonder you should get the same amount of points subtracted from your score that the builder got added to his/her score for building it. It would at least discourage such a nefarious act! I mean really folks, could you even imagine destroying the colisseum or the pyramids??

[MrBaggins]

Should it affect your score? Probably. The question is does that score matter, right now?

A player's score is pretty irrelevant at the moment, IMO... If the game is played through to completion (victory) regularly, and people care about how they did, relatively speaking, then it does. That should happen when we've "fixed" the game as it were.

If you want an effect which might make someone think twice about committing such an atrocity, then you should make it a diplomatic atrocity... your diplomatic regard with all civs goes down... (of course this is assuming that diplomacy means something in general.)

[epeterson]

I agree! But neither the score or diplomatic reputation seem to have any real consequence in the game as they stand right now.

Perhaps automatic trade embargos, (technology included), should take place when your reputation is in the crapper?

[MrBaggins]

Agreed.

An "embargo" is a very specific type of CTP2 restriction, restricting you from forming caravan trade deals for that nations goods... where you get gold in return.

The problem is that gold is effectively meaningless in CTP2, right now...

Thats why we are planning to make that more important, and for alliances to mean something (other than just another cheesy way for a human player to win.)

[epeterson]

Since we are on the subject of wonders...

Has there been a discussion about the wonder that gives worldwide radar coverage?? My brother and I have agreed to NOT build the wonder as it gives an unfair advantage to one player that the other player can NEVER overcome. As a solution, I suggest that when one player builds a wonder the other player can somehow compensate albeit with some sort of penalty.

For example: If I build the Internet wonder, he can build computer centers in all his cities to play catch-up. It's better for play balance this way and it may give you the ability to have a long and fun game. I think the way you have it now is that not only can I build the wonder but I also can have computer centers virtually ensuring my scientific dominance!

Then again...If you have the ability to build the wonder AND computer centers why should you be handicapped just in the interest of play balance??:shrug: I still think the radar coverage wonder needs some serious addressing!

[MrBaggins]

Make it a limited (or minor, depending on what we call the new feature,) wonder

Thus every civ can built it, but only once.

[MrBaggins]

Here's the thread on wonder balancing.

[MrBaggins]

BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!

Almost got everything to compile with bitvectors... and then I hit the GaiaController code... which has to be redone.

[Kull]

Originally posted by MrBaggins
Its kind of a choice a player has to make... IMO

Essentially the reasoning for still allowing you to build an improvement after you've gotten a particular Wonder, is that the virtual buildings that are created can disappear, and you might want to anticipate that, and build actual, real life buildings in their place.

If the city with the wonder in, is conquered, they disappear (for the original player,) as they would if the city was destroyed, or the wonder became obsolete.

Building a replacement wouldn't happen instantly, and a player should be given opportunity to have these building effects be uninterrupted.

Its a (reasonable) design decision, not a bug.

One problem: This advantage (such as it is) accrues only to the human player. The AI isn't smart enough to determine it's about to lose the city containing the Wonder and thus to "plan ahead" by building replacement improvements. Even worse is the far more likely scenario that AI Civs will build both a Wonder AND the related city improvements. While the human player recognizes a waste of production when he sees it, I'm guessing the AI won't make that distinction.