DESIGN: End Game Options/General Strategy

[Maquiladora]

I agree, if i didnt know better id say it was a bug, not a feature.

[child of Thor]

well Civ3 is kinda a dirty word around here

still the idea of 'more upkeep' if outside of your own territory is a sound logistical one to me.

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by child of Thor


well Civ3 is kinda a dirty word around here

I would rather say... "unpopular".

still the idea of 'more upkeep' if outside of your own territory is a sound logistical one to me.

I agree with you on this ground but I think that this is more or less what the "at war" status wants to simulate.

[Myrddin]

I thought 'at war' status allowed the builder an option of more gold/research, without the huge risk of not having many military units

Civ3 used a different design philosophy - features were only included if the AI could use them, rather than because they were cool; what is happening now in CTP2 is working out what features already in the game can be made to work

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by Myrddin
I thought 'at war' status allowed the builder an option of more gold/research, without the huge risk of not having many military units

The "at war" status increases the upkeep cost of each military units along with the hit points of the military units. Though the upkeep cost is immediately raised, the number of hit points is only progressively increased. The military readiness is, as far as I am concerned, a great feature of CtP2 as it allows you to manage the weight of your army on your national production level very efficiently.

Civ3 used a different design philosophy - features were only included if the AI could use them rather than because they were cool...

Excuse me Myrdinn but I don't want to talk once again about Civ3 and about the many features that disappointed me a lot, I can only tell you that I would have liked Infogrammes to think more about the players and about the fact that games must be fun to play... and Civ3 IMO isn't at all (though I have not yet tested "Conquest" I doubt it will make me change my mind) .

But I agree with you that CtP2 was not finished by Activision and that a lot of work remained to be made when the game was released...

... what is happening now in CTP2 is working out what features already in the game can be made to work

IMO this is only a matter of time... and work.

[Maquiladora]

The "at war" status increases the upkeep cost of each military units along with the hit points of the military units. Though the upkeep cost is immediately raised, the number of hit points is only progressively increased. The military readiness is, as far as I am concerned, a great feature of CtP2 as it allows you to manage the weight of your army on your national production level very efficiently.

Did anyone ever use it in CtP2? I certainly didnt or maybe once in a MP game with a VERY large map. I use it in CtP1 because its easier to defend with a slightly damaged unit, in CtP2 its suicide!

[MrBaggins]

The only time I even considered it was when I switched from Communism to Democracy IIRC.

*and I wasn't involved in a war at the time.

[Martin Gühmann]

I think I even tried to keep my armies in war state in CTP1, but I aggree there must be a reason to use the stuff.

-Martin

[Tamerlin]

Originally posted by Maquiladora

Did anyone ever use it in CtP2? I certainly didnt or maybe once in a MP game with a VERY large map. I use it in CtP1 because its easier to defend with a slightly damaged unit, in CtP2 its suicide!

Of course I use it in CtP2, I try to limit the number of military units I am building and thus when I plan a war I want my units to be fully operational...

[drulius]

I use the readiness slider in every game of ctp2. It feels like a great renaissance production boost to go from war to peace and lower the drag on your economy from 39% to 14% of production (that's if I've been a warmonger). Of course I haven't played a game on the hardest difficulty level since I started playing again after the source got released.

It may be my inexperience but I've felt that the AT WAR state was too expensive to be useful once you get to bombard units like bombers, unless you are still behind the AI civs in tech and they have more hardware in the air. Units still have their full bombard abilities when AT PEACE, so if you can weaken the opposition and/or protect your units with air cover you can empty a city with bombers and move in with a stack of AT PEACE archers/warriors.

It seems like I can usually finish a war before my units are up to full health anyway, so I usually save going back to AT WAR for an end game push to World domination when I don't need the economy to do anything except build and maintain units.

[Maquiladora]

The only instance i would consider lowering it is if i have lots of special forces around to react quickly, but supporting all those special forces kind of defeats the point of lowering the military state - to save production.

If i had lots of Knights for example, but my enemy will attack with Knights and M. Archers, and my M. Archers are on 50% health, i suppose it wouldnt matter as much because they are in the back row, but if you want to split off one or two M. Archer to kill something thats not really an option until your new military readiness.

To be honest its something ive never really explored, i just dismissed it because of the way equal-unit combat relies so heavily on current hitpoints. Ill have to find out just how much production support % it would save....

[Maquiladora]

double post

i knew that was going to happen, damn you poly

[Tamerlin]

I use it in every game I play though I have reduced the time needed for the hit points to be fully recovered. I think that I halved the number of turns needed as the 10 (or is it 20) turns limit sounded like a ridiculous amount of time when every turn lasts between 1 to 20 years.

[Maquiladora]

Id like to see an earlier end game, something like a Mars or Alpha Centauri ending, whatever....... but as i was saying to Mr Baggins in the CtP2 chat room, i think its one of the biggest things that keeps some civvers away from CtP games in general. The game lasts too long too anyway IMO..... someone mentioned somewhere else, when you step into science fiction you need to make all the new stuff not only realistic but interesting, but alot of them seem just like a "new and improved version" of Modern units that we're all familiar with, ie Tank and Fusion Tank.

You could even switch the whole game to Mars once the ending happens, so whoever wins the Mars victory gets an extra 2 settlers (or whatever) when it moves onto new Mars terrain. There we could completely copy the AC tech tree lol fighting with Mech Warriors and what not, Im sure Big Mc would like something like that

Of course these would be optional because some of us do like the future eras.

[Tamerlin]

The first times I tested CtP2 I don't remember having been bothered by the length of the game though it was something I clearly felt when I tested the Apolyton Pack. Though the game was much more interesting it was too long for my own taste.

This is the reason why I have reduced the science cost of all the advances and why I am about to reduce the settings once again.