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AOM III Science Victory.

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  • #16
    I am playing now with the impossible difficulty level and agree with a lot of your assessments. I have, for example, also been getting AI aggression before any significant frenzy.

    I also notice a start on "impossible" difficulty features very little good land and wonder if that is intentional.

    I also notice that beginning early in the game, AI get a substantial lead, i.e. become "very advanced." I'm wondering if that is a tweak too, but I thought I'd heard Stan didn't include AI cheats ala Civ, but just bumped up aggressiveness. Anyway, in your case it didn't matter, because you still won.

    Unfortunately, I also notice a game crash around Turn 200 and am wondering if there is something more to that than your individual computer situation. Blaming it on "junk" on your machine I think is bad regardless, as it plays into the hands of the "Detractors" lobby who says our problems with a certain competing game system stem from bad decisions we made in purchasing and subsequently stocking with software our respective machines. I heartily reject this notion. Everything that is "Windows compatible" should run together. But Stan's work is an amateur project, so he can be excused if there is a glitch. We should identify it so maybe it can be addressed, though.

    I've been building at least one diplomat earlier, even though its an expensive thing. You seem to tolerate a few wars more than I like to. Maybe I should change to your point of view, there's plenty of other things to build, early game. But without that embassy and first reception, I do find the AI seek war quickly, with a few exceptions.
    You will soon feel the wrath of my myriad swordsmen!


    • #17
      Sorry for the staggered posting. Too many visitors and late night world cup matches.

      Turn 250.Time elapsed for next 50 turns, approx 2 hours.

      38 cities, Tribunal Empire, targeting Civic Engineering.I continued my plan to expand to the east to acquire the barbarian cities and claim land where there were medicinal goods. This is on track. There is one Barb city left and I am planning on gifting that and one other to the Dutch so I have a buffer.In the meantime I am churning out Migrants in a couple of Barb cities to build border forts and enlarge newly built cities.

      Frenzy is 53 despite not capturing a non barbarian city. Due mainly to advances, outposts and wonders. Kush made peace after an intensive war of 120 turns in which they attacked on a front of 30 tiles. Being on the defensive meant we could contain the attacks. After we were at peace I used 3 Royal Princess' to acquire 2 frontier kush cities as my empire was very thin and elongated.

      However, a Phoenecian stack appeared almost out of no where and tried to take Portsmouth. I left a sacrificial unit in its way to make them declare war or withdraw as I raced up reinforcements. They killed the unit then went all out for Portsmouth. We held on by only 3 units. They then sued for peace. At the moment we have met all but one AI, and are at peace wih ALL, 5 have peace treaties with us.

      I made a concerted effort ot establish embassies and trade technology. That way I got Republic then built 7 spy units which then targetted the French. This way I beat the French to Concrete but only just.

      The main challenge for the next 50 turns is to pushg by borders out far enough to give me time to respond to the barbarian threat. At this point, in hindsight, I should have also targeted a diplomatic victory. There is a small window of opportunity before anyone researches Theology (when the middle ages religious differences kick in) to go for this option, but I was focused on a science victory and keeping one foot in the door for a points victory as well.

      The north front, I am intending to build a fort here and pushe the border back.

      The far east, one barb city to go.

      The main south front, things are nice and quiet now that Kush have finally given up. They are also under a lot of pressure from their neighbours.
      Also proud to be an AOM Warrior.


      • #18

        I have not lost a game of AOM entirely for a long time, unlike civ 4, whoops, sorry. I haved always been able to get back from autosave. There is a save game bug mentioned in the readme and if you follow that, you should always finish a game without drama.

        As far as I know, the only difficulty related code stan wrote in is for the points for an AOM victory. The rest comes from what is hardcoded in the map generator etc. I personally am surprised how aggressive the Kush got when i never attacked them. But it proved their downfall as their neighbours attacked them and took a lot of territory of them and they are very weak now.

        No two games of AOM evolve the same. I don't take seriously war with AI that are far away as you should be able to scout them and defeat them. Eventually those AI, even if aggressive, will ask for a cease fire.
        Also proud to be an AOM Warrior.


        • #19

          I'll look at the readme, think my favored game is gone, gone, but at least maybe it'll never happen again. Will also keep my cool during AI war in the future, it is something new as I played "other games" at relatively low levels sometimes deliberately just to build a pretty empire and there's more challenge to this. Played a certain other game over the weekend at a somewhat higher level than usual to deflect criticism that I have never experienced the true "AI potential" of that game. But I'll be back to AOM shortly.
          You will soon feel the wrath of my myriad swordsmen!


          • #20
            Turn 300. 50 turns of consolidation. 1.75 hours.

            38 cities (one to be gifted to Dutch this turn after last migrant extracted). Tribunal Empire, researching Dark Ages. Gold and PW saved for Dark Ages. I have been concentrating on science buildings in cities once happiness (including overcrowding ) is taken care off.

            Consolidation. The empire is stable and secure for the time being. The main problem has been lack of some key goods (mainly medicinal) and the elongated shape which makes me nervous. I embarked on a program of pushing back the borders as far as possible to join up with AI or give me breathing space for future incursions. As a result we have long common borders with the dutch, Kush and hexegonian. Secure for the time being.This has provided 4 cartels including one in spices.

            Every point of the border is now under observation. Caesar waits with the main army NE of London facing the northern wasteland. Forts guard the NW and SW.

            I now realise that I did let an opportunity to go for a diplomatic victory as well slip. I did not actively look for the Vikings, the last ai i had not met and had I done so, I may have tried for a diplomacy win. I was clearly in the lead for a while and could have used gold and gifts to bribe the AI. Now the French and Arabs are gaining power and as both are aggressive, I don't think it is now possible unless I go to war and trim their power.The Arabs just declared war but are no threat at the moment.

            Seat belt fastened for the Dark Ages.

            A fort guards the NW where we pushed our borders up to the Hexegonians.

            The NE. Caesar waits at another fort.

            The far east. The empire is only 20 tiles wide at this point. Most of our medicinal goods are here.

            The wild south. Another fort on a mountian.

            Also proud to be an AOM Warrior.


            • #21
              Turn 360 report. Cities, 40, Tribunal Empire, researching Loom. Target Greek Fire and Plate Armour but turn 400.Time for next 50 turns, 2.25 hours.

              The Dark Ages were different again. I started building some catapults around turn 380. I rode the happiness hit pretty easily except when I got a rebellion at the same time caesar died. I had to go round and put 3-4 entertainers in each city then remove them down to 1 once thing settled down. Otherwise, by having +3 happiness for my first 5 outposts on class 1 goods and another +1 for 10 food outposts and keeping 1 entertainer in each city, I only had to periodically check the empire manager.

              I correctly anticipated where 2 Barb infantry spawns would occur and after 20 turns of heavy fighting, got rid of those. however, there was a surprise spawn up in Hexegonian territory almost due north of london. They captured 3 Hex cities then turned towards me. Again some heavy fighting and we got rid of them and captured and disbanded one of the barb cities. Attila spawned almost due west of london, inside Hex territory where there were 2 tiles unowned. About 4 tiles from my border. This caught me by surprise but also gave me enough time to move to stacks to his area. We had to wait for him as he went in and out of Hex terriroty but gradually got rid of him.

              The main issue developing is that Arabia and France are continuing to grow in power and are both aggressive types. I made peace with Arabia but they have captured several Hex cities to the NE and just now a stack of Praetorians and catapults are encroaching. I have treaties with 6 of 10 players but doubt I will be able to get the other 4 now the diplomacy adjustment for the Dark Ages has kicked in. By paying tribute and gifting advances or answering aid calls, i have got frenzy down to 0.

              Science. I started building latifudia on forest tiles all round my empire. As well as having always had a few scientists since turn 250 to reduce the turns for next advance by 1-2. After the dark Ages settled down, I cranked up the scientists as much as I could. Something i had not noticed before, cities that a few Latifundia produced a lot more science points for each additional scientist, than cities with no Latifundia. So I started making some super science cities by building latifundias around them. I did a calculation and worked out at my present rate I should get to the objective with about 2 turns to spare.
              Cambridge is now a science city.

              I like big buffers where possible round the empire.

              I did a small expansion to the west toanother sea.

              The new Tribute function was very handy to improve relations and get frenzy down.

              Also proud to be an AOM Warrior.


              • #22
                I'm still reading, I assume others are too.

                Curious why the latifundia work better in forests; the bit about science is a valuable tip, regardless.
                You will soon feel the wrath of my myriad swordsmen!


                • #23
                  Turn 400 report. Victory by 1 turn. I had an extra turn up my sleeve but on turn 380 I got a big plague that knocked my science research up by 1 turn and that had me worried.In the end I should have build Latifundia earlier and switched to more scientists and it would have not been quiet so tight.I have one thing to say, Stan, a Science victory should be worth more than 25 points if you are going to continue.It was not easy and at times, I had to hold my nerve with a small military to keep upkeep costs to a minimum.

                  Time to play last 50 turns, 1.5 hours. 40 cities, now researching Printing Press.

                  I kept up a small territorial expansion to complete one more cartel and get to 10 luxury goods. Otherwise the main issue is that the Arabs are almost with me on the powergraph still, very aggressive (having captured 4+ Hex cities in the last 30 turns) and now turning their attention to me.I have had to defeat 2 stacks that were all Praetorian/Man at Arms and catapult (7/5, the perfect combination for heavy work). 3 more stacks coming. This front will continue to be a drain. In addition, the French who have expanded closer, are aslo at war now and they have similar tech to the Arabs.

                  The Hexegonians are just about had it, lost cities to Arabia, Barbarian and also French. However, they did shield me for 200 valuable turns.At this time I am seriously short of military and will now have to give that a priority if I was to continue. Which means going for the 2nd science victory is probably out of the question.

                  Definitely a lot to be said for pushing your borders up to a friendly ai type and keeping friendly with them. The Dutch did the same job at the other end as Hexegonia did in the west.

                  In hindsight, there are several places where I may have fallen short of the science quest. I was eventually short of good space which did not help. I got a few more advances from ruins than normal (probably 2-3). In the end this could have been decisive. I did keep a foot in a normal point victory for the first 300 turns, building some wonders which in hindsight may have been better avoided and the production turned into Universities and latifundia etc. (IMHO cities can specialise very nicely in AOM anyway). Not building military seems to eventually cause more aggressive types to target you (which is perfectly understandable). If I had been closer to either france or Arabia, I would have had to build much more military which would add that upkeep cost and reduce science. All in all, it was just as tense as a full on conquest game but like every game of AOM, evolves differently to the last.

                  Due to work and personal commitments, decided not to play on. Will be thinking about my strategy for the competition now and then start again on a full campaign next week.

                  My first ever Science Monument

                  The Arabian front. They have pushed us back gradually over the last 20 turns.

                  Also proud to be an AOM Warrior.


                  • #24
                    Generaldoktor, it is not that Latifundia work better on forests, it is that you cannot build a farm or a mine in a forest/swamp/jungle but can build a Latifundia. So I concentrated on cities that had this terrain.

                    Then once they have a few Latifundia, then put more scientists here. Not really that complicated, just I always in the past had my cities in general mode where they did a bit of everything.
                    Also proud to be an AOM Warrior.