New to CtP2

[Shogun Gunner]

Hello everyone.

I'm new to the Call to Power forums. I've seen some of you in the Civ2 or Civ3 forums, but it seems many game players are either in the Civ forums or the CtP forums. Interesting.

When CtP1 first came out, I purchased and gave it a try. Perhaps the interface was too different, too many new concepts, learning curve - whatever, I ended up returning back to Civ2. Then, I took a break from gaming -- returning right around the time of PTW - staying with Civ3 and C3C (Conquests) until last week.

Last week, I dusted off CtP1, installed the game and played a game or two. Wow. Maybe its because I got use to the "non-Civ2" Civ3 interface that I became more open to CtP's interface. Lots of people still prefer Civ2's interface over any Civ3 variant or CtP release.

Anyway, I the Public Works concept and the Stacked Combat. I had such a good time that I went to Amazon and found CtP2 for sale. Wow, it's hard to find this game now...it's not sold in any traditional retail outlets. A few questions.

How much different is CtP2 from the original?

Is the stacked combat changed in CtP2? Flanking?

In CtP1 when my stack attacked a 1 pop city on a hill, my horses and cannons were destroyed when victorous because they were not allowed to enter that terrain type...that seems like a flaw. Is this in CtP2?

Bombard seems a bit powerful...easy to totally wipe out land units with your naval units. The same in CtP2?

I've been reading the threads in the section -- what great work Solver, Maq, Locutus and others have done to organize CtP information. Thanks!

[child of Thor]

Re: New to CtP2

Originally posted by Shogun Gunner
edit......

How much different is CtP2 from the original?

There are a few differences that seem to make me prefer CTP2 over CTP1, although i did enjoy CTP1 when that first came out.

For me the biggest thing is the country border that CTP2 uses, you have a zone of influence around your cities and this has the gameplay aspect of making you try to place your cities so this zone overlaps - creating reasonably realistic country borders. You can only build tile improvements inside these borders.

Second the stacked combat has been improved in CTP2(upto 12 units now) - flanking units do just that, attack from the sides, so its possible to have a frontline engagement with the usual ranged attack option and now when a space opens up in the enemies front line your 'flanking' units also get an attack in. Its just another level of 'realism' that i like.
On the downside it can be exploited to give the human player a big advantage over the AI(in that the AI does have issues in organising its armies well).

And the third big sell for me is the Modding and source-code work. All the new and latest stuff is being done on CTP2, and its pretty close to being the best(IMHO) historic tbs released to date, especialy if your after a more 'real-world' type of civ game(anti ICS etc).

If you do track down a copy of CTP2 - then its essential to have a go at the mods that are described elsewhere in these forums, they do atleast make the game a challange.
And once you've got the hang of that - then i'm sure the source code project is a good thing to keep an eye on. Hopefully the guys working on it will get a much better and fixed standard game of CTP2 in the next few months(its already much improved in the single player game).

Oh and welcome to CTP2 forums

[Maquiladora]

Re: New to CtP2

Originally posted by Shogun Gunner
I'm new to the Call to Power forums. I've seen some of you in the Civ2 or Civ3 forums, but it seems many game players are either in the Civ forums or the CtP forums. Interesting.

Its hard to go back to pushing hundreds of workers/settlers and units around once youre used to PW and stacked combat.

How much different is CtP2 from the original?

To add to what CoT said, basically city improvements (granary etc) and trade (monopolies for science) are more important in CtP1 while tile improvements (farms etc) and specialists (scientists etc) are more important in CtP2. Activision kinda swung too far the other way when they were looking to fix imbalances in CtP1. I expect us to make everything useful once the more important things are fixed in the sourcecode.

Resources are collected differently in CtP2 than any other civ game too. These threads describe how it works.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=49519

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=47498

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=17362

In CtP1 when my stack attacked a 1 pop city on a hill, my horses and cannons were destroyed when victorous because they were not allowed to enter that terrain type...that seems like a flaw. Is this in CtP2?

I think you mean mountain instead of hill. Yeah it still exists because mounted and wheeled units cant move on mountains without roads. IIRC last we got upto in the sourcecode was having a poll on how it should be dealt with a size 1 city when it gets captured by those units, so its likely to be fixed soon.

Bombard seems a bit powerful...easy to totally wipe out land units with your naval units. The same in CtP2?

Well you cant bombard land in CtP2 until you get Battleships, and you have Bombers and Artillery to counter it at that time, so its much more balanced in CtP2. Although a few of the units still need rebalancing in default CtP2. In CtP1 you could bombard land with Ship of the Line and they also carried units so they were a kind of super unit.

Also bombard is less powerful because flanking ability is important, and the flanking units are all fast units, whereas the bombarding units are generally slower, so bombarding isnt the be all in CtP2.

[Shogun Gunner]

Thanks child of Thor and Maquiladora!!! Is my imagination or is this game more popular with the Europeans than the Americans?

I was lucky enough to find a "barely used" copy of CtP2 on Amazon.com for $15. I bought it yesterday and should get it in about a week.

I found myself agreeing at many points in both posts.... the Ship of Line superunit for sure! , yes it was a mountain that killed my wheeled units (that's what they get for winning a battle )

All the new and latest stuff is being done on CTP2, and its pretty close to being the best(IMHO) historic tbs released to date, especialy if your after a more 'real-world' type of civ game(anti ICS etc).

That's a big plus for me. The ICS issue, not completely solved in Civ3, can really increase the tedium. I'll keep an eye on the CtP2 source code project forum.

Thanks for the welcome guys. I should have stopped by a long time ago.

[Solver]

Yeah, you should . Again, there's this advantage that CtP2 is getting better, with bugfixes, AI improvements, etc., while Civ 3 isn't.

The city limit I personally find annoying or at least wrongly done, but overall CtP2 is indeed the best Civ game to date.

[Shogun Gunner]

Re: Re: New to CtP2

Originally posted by Maquiladora

Resources are collected differently in CtP2 than any other civ game too. These threads describe how it works.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=49519

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=47498

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=17362

Hey Maquiladora, I think you pasted the title and not the URL here. The links don't work.

[Shogun Gunner]

Originally posted by Solver
Yeah, you should . Again, there's this advantage that CtP2 is getting better, with bugfixes, AI improvements, etc., while Civ 3 isn't.

Yes, it's a poor showing for Firaxis - the game significantly changed from Civ3 vanilla, to Civ3 PTW, and to C3C with substantial changes in the patches for C3C. That's pretty close to unacceptable in my mind. They should work on fixing existing problems and not rolling out additional units, civs, features, etc.

I still like Civ3 - currently in several PBEMS - and I'm hoping (maybe foolishly, maybe not) that cIV will be great. However, cIV won't be released for sometime. I'll excited to give CtP2 a go - especially the source code project you and others are working on.

[Ekmek]

SG,

In my sig I converted mostly SnOOpys civ3 terrain graphics to Ctp2 in case you are used to Civ3's style.

[Martin Gühmann]

Re: Re: Re: New to CtP2

Originally posted by Shogun Gunner

Originally posted by Maquiladora

Resources are collected differently in CtP2 than any other civ game too. These threads describe how it works.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=49519

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=47498

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=17362

Hey Maquiladora, I think you pasted the title and not the URL here. The links don't work.

Well try these ones:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=49519
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=47498
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=17362

-Martin

[Maquiladora]

Re: Re: Re: New to CtP2

Originally posted by Shogun Gunner


Hey Maquiladora, I think you pasted the title and not the URL here. The links don't work.

Yes sorry rushed it

[HuangShang]

EPW has an US flag, i live in California

but yeah, u should know its hard to get americans to play older games, no need to mention TBS

[Dis]

I'm thinking about trying this game out one more time. I was going to try to sell the game to Tass, but he backed out.

I hate spending money on a game I don't play, and there many concepts in this game that seem cool.

but I still prefer vanilla versions of the game, though I may try the mods. But for the most part I avoid mods, I tend to not like them for some reason.

[Shogun Gunner]

I just received my purchase via FedEx this week. I installed the game last night and I will hopefully get some free time to try it out tonight.

You are right Diss. There are some cool concepts in this game. I'm eager to start.

[Martin Gühmann]

Originally posted by Dissident
but I still prefer vanilla versions of the game, though I may try the mods. But for the most part I avoid mods, I tend to not like them for some reason.

What do you have against some more city styles, goods, AI improvements and some small additions (just to summarize ApolytonPack + GoodMod)?

-Martin

[Maquiladora]

I know how Diss feels, I suppose thats why I play MP, but Martin is right, you need at least Apolyton Pack for a good AI in SP. Just think of it as an official patch that improves the AI and a little balance, rather than one of those mods thats someone elses vision of the game and changes it totally.