Medieval Pack 3.0

[WesW]

Well, it's finally up!
The second beta for the Medieval Pack 3.0 is ready for play-testing. It is available at my homepage, listed in the link here. Below is the text from the Introduction page, which should be enough to get you started.

The only feature of the modpack not included in this beta is the new advances. This means that the units may seem clumped together, and the timeline will probably pass too slowly, due to the new trade goods.
Our play-testing needs to find out if the units stats are properly balanced, how well the new Wonders enhance the game, and whether everything works or not.
Please post any questions and/or comments about the mod here.
The site, and modpack, logo is of Neuschwanstein castle in Bavaria.

Introduction to the Medieval Pack 3.0
By Wes Whitaker

The Medieval Pack 3.0 contains a number of individual mods, which are fully integrated to provide a one-step installation process. This modpack combines those mods found in the Apolyton Pack with the Medieval mod 3.0, a customized version of Nordicus' New Trade goods mod, and three SLIC triggers from the SLIC group.

The Medieval mod 3.0 contains 4 new units and 7 new Wonders, as well as numerous smaller changes, and a totally reorganized readme structure to explain them. The SLIC triggers are explained in the Med 3 readme, while the new goods and their effects are listed in the Terrain sheet of the new Med charts spreadsheet.

I have devoted many hours of time to the new readme structure, in order to make it as concise and informative as possible. Users start with the Read 1st text, which briefly explains the reorganization, and tells you which files need to be read before you begin using the mod, and in what order to read them.
I have constructed spreadsheets which list individual unit and terrain stats, and an advances chart which is modeled on the one which accompianied the game. These are provided for users to print out for reference while playing the game. These files are best seen in the original Word and Excel formats that they were created in, but excellent HTML versions of them are provided for users who do not have access to these programs.
These charts allowed me to use the readmes for descriptions of general changes to the various parts of the game, to point out specific changes to unit abilities and Wonder effects, and to list odd changes that did not fit into any of the charts. The net effect of this is that the combined length of the new, recommended Pack readmes is less than half of that of CD's 4.2 readme. I believe that this new approach does an excellent job of providing the user with all the info one needs to understand the modpack, without being overwhelmed with details.

This modpack contains the efforts of many people, without whom it could not have been made. These people, and their specific contributions, are listed at the start of the Med 3 readme. Please take the time to read this, and acknowledge those people either in the Apolyton forums, or through personal emails. I know that your kind words would be appreciated.

This concludes your introduction to the Medieval Pack 3.0. I hope you enjoy.

Wes Whitaker

[WesW]

Well, I played a game for a few hours tonight, and either;
1) I am not that good of a player anymore (I haven't played the game hardly any the past few months), or
2) The AI has adjusted to the new changes much better than I have.

I am about at turn 140 or so, and I am dead last in *every* category!

It's clear already that the SLIC triggers cause you to change your build queues.
Btw, the militia units *do* exert martial law in my game. Anyone have any comments on this?
The goods changes seem to be an enormous help to the AIs.
Establishing diplomtic relations seems to be more crucial than ever, for purposes of tech trading. I fell behind in this, and now I can't catch up. The AIs continue to trade amonst themselves, and I am left out of the loop. It is also clear that there is plenty of room for adding new advances. The AIs are close to a 1000 yrs ahead of where they should be tech-wise.

In my unit changes for this edition, I reduced the bombard values of the naval units. However, the AI still sends its ships over to bombard my cities, even though it does almost no damage, and loses the ship to my counter-bombarding artillery.
I will try taking away the bombard land ability of pre-industrial age ships, and see how that works.
The AIs need to build land units, and launch ampihbious invasions. Have any of you noticed if the AI is doing that any more than they used to?

Btw, I built the Cohort, and it seems to make a big difference in battle. The AIs have had no problem gobbling up all the Wonders, including the new ones, so I am pleased with that. When the new advances are in to slow the timeline down, it should allow them more time to build units and city improvements.

Overall, the new changes seem to all be making the game better. I just wish we could get the AI to mount invasions.

[MadWoodster]

I played for a bit last night on the new mod and noticed it a lot harder to get any wonder I think while I got the Labrinth the computer had got 5 other wonders. Great idea making the Cohort have a negative effect as well, makes it more realistic. I'm currently doing a bit of work on the terrain to make it easier to move around a gigantic map. One suggestion I have is to reduce the number of advances both the human and computer has to start with and also the list of advances they can start with in the diffdb.txt file.

[WesW]

I think it was Paul who suggested the negative effect for the Cohort. I had forgotten about that. I wondered why the Mexicans suddenly attacked me soon after I got the wonder.

[WesW]

I started a new game tonight. I am at turn 124, where I decided to take a break, and do thorough evaluation of the AIs. I am playing on a normal-sized map, with 5 AI opponents.

Every one of the AI's PW% is set to 20, which made me *very* happy. Their wgf sliders are either set to the defaults, or they are giving max wages so they can increase prod. and/or cut rations. In spite of paying their people all they can, all the civs are strong in science. (I am tied for 4th right now on the advances chart, as far as I can tell.) Happiness is not a problem for anyone, either.
Worker placement for all the AIs seems set to max production, but a check of the civ screen shows that they are all storing between one-third and one-half of their food intake, which is much better than I ever recall seeing it. This is at 1140 AD, and some of the AI cities are size 8 and 9- remarkable.
Unit costs are lower than I have ever seen them, too. From 16 to 20% at full readiness. The expected percentage under the previous Med mods was 10% higher. In spite of the way the AIs are flying through the tech chart, they are all pretty much filling out their primary units lists, and getting some of the core units as well. I can't wait to see what they do when we add the new advances to slow the timeline down. Again, very exciting.

The only thing I saw that concerned me any was that there are so many different goods now, the AIs are not able to get multiples of more than two or three. Only one civ had more than two of any one good, and they are through most of the city founding stage.

For those of you how haven't gotten this mod yet; what are you waiting on?!
For those of you who do decide to get it, I would like for you to take about 10 to 15 minutes every 100 turns or so, open up the cheat mode, and check out how the AIs are doing. Specifically, check these things:

1)How are the wgf sliders set? What are they maximizing and cutting?
2)Check out the two or three biggest cities for each civ, note their size, and see if they have to use entertainers.
3)Open the screens tab, and see about what percentage the civ is storing of its food.
4)In the units screen, what production percentage is going to unit support at full readiness?

Note these things, and give a general summary like I have here. I believe that the more you understand the AIs, the more you will appreciate the difference these mods are making on AI performance.

[DiscoveryOne]

Just so you don't think that I'm ignoring you and the Mod, I'll download and playtest it when I get back from vacation (about Thursday). I'm pretty worked about it!

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"I do not pretend to know that which the less educated and less intelligent are certain of." -- T.H. Huxley

[Herr Glockenspiel]

Thank you for this. It is the modpacks that make C:CTP worth playing.

[WesW]

John, you're missing all the fun! Grab a laptop, and play on the beach.

Oh well, back to the mod...
I have a whole list of small changes, based on the effects of the reduced unit costs and SLIC triggers.
1)The militias are exerting martial law, which we didn't expect, but I find that I really like it, so I am leaving it in.
2)I made historical and gameplay gls for the ironclad, which I had forgotten to make earlier.
3)I would like to give militias their own special tga, so you could always tell which one they are when looking at the units tab.
4)I noticed that there seemed to be too many nobles and dips roaming around, and I found that the aips allowed the AIs to build 2 of these units at a time. I set this to 1.
5)I also reduced the priority of the scout troops core, since those units should not be needed.
6)I reduced that production cost of militia units to 5. This may not do anything, but when the units were killed, half their production cost may have been recouped, so I went ahead and made this change.
7)I made Archers obsolete with Engineering, when the Siege Engine becomes available. This may help the AIs update their units faster.
8)I increased the number of units allowed outside your cities by 5 to 10 for each government. With the increased numbers of units being built, it is necessary to station more of them as border guards. This allows you to do so without the war discontent becoming such a big problem.

I will wait a couple of days to gather more info, and post these changes on my site as the beta 2.1.

[TheBirdMan]

I'm taking a copy down now. Only changes of my own will be the map-size (128x256) and the number of civs (11 + babarians).

By the way - in your last release. Did you include some of the old stuff (Nordicus' Wastlands) or did I make some "mixing" by mistake? Personaly I like the Wastlands.

And one more thing: Be carefull for the Eglitarian Act. One big nation had this wonder for some time, when suddendly it got half the cities from the one with the AI-entity (when that one revolted). And short after itself turned into riots and revolt due to citylimit of it's government.

2 big nations crushed in no time. The Wastlands ruled - indeed they ruled. Crushed 2 other small nations totally.

[WesW]

Woodstock, do you mean Wastelands? Is this the Barbarians?
I am not familiar with this name, so it must be something from Nord's mod.

[TheBirdMan]

Yes, it's from the AAIPs, one of the first versions. I know that you took some of it out in the final release.... But somehow it's back again.

Well, it might be the way I install all mods - I don't use senarios. I simply copy all changes to their default folders.

But it's fun anyway.

And now to something quite different:

Timeline: Renaissance already in year 740, just as you already know.

Wonders: For the first time since AAIPs, I got first to a wonder. This was "Solomons Temple". I nearly got another: "Great Library", but-but-but. No, MISSED!

I don't even try to go for the wonders "first in the AIP list". The AI are just to quick - everytime.

[Lord Sigma]

Great job, Wes. Your medieval mods and aips have mad ctp far FAR more challenging. Before winning was easy but now staying alive is a challenge .

However, i notice that Cavalry is not 3 0 2 4 which gives it the same attack and defense as knights but with faster movement. Was this intentional?

Also i recommend switching the musketeer sprite back to the original so the Arquebusier and musketeer do not have the same sprites.

[WesW]

I uploaded the 2.1 beta tonight, so go right out and get it!
I don't have the new tga for the Militia units yet, but that shouldn't be a problem.

Sigma, Cavalry have a 3 to 2 edge over Knights in firepower, due to their guns.

[This message has been edited by WesW (edited April 05, 2000).]

[MadWoodster]

Shouldn't this 2.1 beta be called the 3.1 beta as I presume its the next version of version 3 of the Medpack, not another version of 2.1 which whe had a while ago.

[WesW]

I did some checking, and Lord Sigma is right. I have the Arquebusier tgas in the graphics file left in from the Med mod 2.1, when I used those in place of the original Musketeer files.
Users need to go into the pictures folder, and manually delete the four files for unit number 22: CU022F, UPU022, UPU022B, and UPUA22.
When I made this change for the Med mod 2.1, I didn't realize that this would be a problem in the future. I have taken these files out for the next time I upload the graphics file, but that will not fix the problem for people who have downloaded prior versions of the mod.

Woodster, I called this the 2.1 beta because it is a minor update to the second beta for the Med Pack 3.0. (See my initial post in this thread.)
There will be at least one more major beta, 3.0, when I put in the new advances. I mean to do that next.