Governments, civilizations, ethnicity and how they relate in the game

[Mark_Everson]

I'm bumping this thread up since the topic came up in the D7&8 Planning thread, and I didn't want to divert the discussion there. The quote that got me to finding this thread was:

Originally posted by Gary Thomas
(snip) The notion that there is a single whole history scenario is wrong. It cannot even be considered until we have some idea of how new civilizations appear. A whole history scenario becomes another Civilization clone - you are the French in 4000BC, led by Joan of Arc, for heavens sake, and you have to survive to 2050AD.

Careful thought leads me to the conclusion that the only civilization that existed in 4000BC and which still exists is the Laplanders. They win! Even without spaceships.

I disagree with the premise of the quote as can be seen from my statements in the second post of this thread. I believe that a whole-history game of Clash can easily be made to work and many of our players will choose to play most of their games that way. I am sure also that others will prefer scenarios. I am personally commited to having one or many such whole-history scenarios. They are in fact the sort of games I most like for playing civ-type games.

[Lord God Jinnai]

There is another nation that arguably could be said to have existed that long, China, but i don't agree with that as i believe the mongol invasion was a destruction of their nation.

Anyways from what i've been led to believe, no country will survive until the end of the game if you go through history, but at certain times, during civil wars, breakups, independance movements, etc the player can convert to the new nation.

Plus some nations change to become others by incorperating other nations, like the German Conferdation which consisted mostly of Prussia and 46 small indepedant nations which eventually would've been conquered at that rate by Prussia, they formed Germany.

[Gary Thomas]

I disagree with the premise of the quote as can be seen from my statements in the second post of this thread. I believe that a whole-history game of Clash can easily be made to work and many of our players will choose to play most of their games that way.

I do really like the idea of a Player being able to shift horses. I hadn't realized that that was the plan. That certainly will make a whole of history scenario possible. A very large number of them in fact. Not just one.

I am sure also that others will prefer scenarios. I am personally commited to having one or many such whole-history scenarios. They are in fact the sort of games I most like for playing civ-type games.

I personally never play scenarios in Civilization and the like (which is why I rejected Europa Universalis), but only the random map, random civilization scenarios. The others bore me.

However my original statement that we need a way of generating new civilizations still applies.

Cheers

[Straybow]

Careful thought leads me to the conclusion that the only civilization that existed in 4000BC and which still exists is the Laplanders. They win! Even without spaceships.

No, the Laplanders are that Nomad Settlers unit you got from tipping a hut in 3850BC who are still around roading and irrigating the tundra when you send your Finlander OCC Spaceship to Alpha Centauri.

[ruskiyparen]

Wow, from what I heard just on this thread makes me want to get my hands on this game. It almost sounds like real history!

[Mark_Everson]

Hi, ruskiyparen, yeah our idea is to get at least some of the broad features of history right. At least when reality doesn't conflict with the Fun! Thanks for the words of encouragement