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  • CMN strategies to keep the AI balanced

    I have CMNed a few games, and am playing in a few PBEM. While Darnan's fast start is not for me - the extra units, etc. distort faction balance IMHO (but that's like discussing female anatomy, nobody is right or wrong, we just have different priorities ), he has come up with an excellent strategy to keep the AI in play and competitive with the players.

    The three AI's are Miriam, the Hive, and the Spartans. They are all pacted together, which means (I used a scenario editor to test this) that they will vote as a block. This means that building the Empath Guild does NOT become quite so powerful, you still need a coalition of the other players to get elected. Between Miriam and the Hive some AI will always be up for election until well into the midgame.

    Plus he gave Miriam the Planetary Datalinks. Evil, and combined with the pact, very effective. It means that the AI will never fall too far behind the players, as between trading or parallel research you will routinely get three players with the tech. It also makes sense, and could be argued to more effectively represent the network of fanatics supporting her cause. In the game I'm playing, combined with some superior starting locations and the de facto sharing of techs by pacted AI's, the AI's in this game will probably beat the humans to Air Power.

    The only thing that would have strengthened this combo would have been better interpenetration of the AI pacted empires, so their units come in contact and they trade more with each other. I may combine that with my own strategies, which I will mention below. (By the way, I've seen links to an article by Ogie or Googlie on scenario editing, if anybody has the link please post it here).

    I edit the AI tech foward and give them clean reactors and prototypes certain units, then take their techs back down. I also carefully pare the prototypes to what I want them to build. This can lead to the AI building things like Clean Formers and whatever mix of military units you think makes the most sense (i.e. 1-3t-1 clean garrisons). On larger sized maps this can lead to a much more competitive AI, as the overproduction of units doesn't screw things up as badly.

    Giving the initial bases a Recreation Commons can help as the AI is really not that good at managing drones. However, in scenario building I discovered that you can give the AI too many base facilities, and they start grabbing the SP's all over again. Some free terraforming also helps, I like to give the AI a road net and sometimes a few boreholes, for whatever reason the AI seems very bad at creating those. Rain Forests - jungle forests - seem to be extremely potent for the AI, and I've had to be careful about them. The AI will grab alot of SP's if you put them in the jungle with a Rain Forest economy and clean units. Enough so that you need to be fairly careful.

    The same applies to mineral resource mine squares, especially with crawlers. Let the AI have a crawler that begins at that kind of location, and it will build SP's almost from the start, and beat the humans due to the reduced costs for transcend level AI's. In fact combining Rain Forests with crawlered mineral resource mines means humans will get almost none of the first five SP's This is something which to me reduces the fun of the game, going after those early SP's is a critical part of the early game strategy.

    I've found putting Energy Resources under bases gives the AI a much better chance to maintain research parity with humans, the AI is just so bad at managing research. Besides doing that, and the obvious jungle squares, extra mines and monoliths, roads, and base sensors, what other techniques have you folks come up with to keep the AI competitive, but not too powerful. This is for all the people new to CMNing due to the interest the rerelease of SMAX has produced.
    The worst form of insubordination is being right - Keith D., marine veteran. A dictator will starve to the last civilian - self-quoted
    And on the eigth day, God realized it was Monday, and created caffeine. And behold, it was very good. - self-quoted
    Klaatu: I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it.
    Mr. Harley: I'm afraid my people haven't. I'm very sorry… I wish it were otherwise.

  • #2
    I was wondering why my ears were burning this morning.....

    Originally posted by shawnmmcc
    While Darnan's fast start is not for me - the extra units, etc. distort faction balance IMHO (but that's like discussing female anatomy, nobody is right or wrong, we just have different priorities ), he has come up with an excellent strategy to keep the AI in play and competitive with the players.
    I, along with other CMN's, have come up with multiple strategies to keep the AI's more competitive deeper into both SP and PBEM games.

    Originally posted by shawnmmcc
    The three AI's are Miriam, the Hive, and the Spartans. They are all pacted together, which means (I used a scenario editor to test this) that they will vote as a block. This means that building the Empath Guild does NOT become quite so powerful, you still need a coalition of the other players to get elected. Between Miriam and the Hive some AI will always be up for election until well into the midgame.

    Plus he gave Miriam the Planetary Datalinks. Evil, and combined with the pact, very effective. It means that the AI will never fall too far behind the players, as between trading or parallel research you will routinely get three players with the tech. It also makes sense, and could be argued to more effectively represent the network of fanatics supporting her cause. In the game I'm playing, combined with some superior starting locations and the de facto sharing of techs by pacted AI's, the AI's in this game will probably beat the humans to Air Power.

    The only thing that would have strengthened this combo would have been better interpenetration of the AI pacted empires, so their units come in contact and they trade more with each other. I may combine that with my own strategies, which I will mention below.
    You should also mention the layout of the map, as it favours the AI's ability to defend its territory/ core bases.


    Originally posted by shawnmmcc
    (By the way, I've seen links to an article by Ogie or Googlie on scenario editing, if anybody has the link please post it here).
    Its in The SMAC Academy .

    Originally posted by shawnmmcc
    I've found putting Energy Resources under bases gives the AI a much better chance to maintain research parity with humans, the AI is just so bad at managing research. Besides doing that, and the obvious jungle squares, extra mines and monoliths, roads, and base sensors, what other techniques have you folks come up with to keep the AI competitive, but not too powerful. This is for all the people new to CMNing due to the interest the rerelease of SMAX has produced.
    IMO Energy is the best thing to give the AI. If you give them extra Nuts, they just end up supporting early Drones. Give them extra Minerals, and the AI just ends up supporting more obsolete units.

    Personally, I have resisted efforst in the past to publicly catalogue all the tricks available to CMN's, as if this was done then once the tricks become widely known then it will take away some of the magic for players of exploring maps/ encountering AI's. I would say if you are really interested in going farther down that rabbit hole and becoming a full fledged CMN then contact Googlie about learning all of the tricks of the trade. But understand that one of the reasons I really don't play PBEM's anymore is simply because I don't enjoy them that much, because there just isn't that level of magic in exploring and encountering AI's.

    I will now close with the observation that the sign of a truly great CMN is that he (or she) doesn't use any initial SP's for the AI's, that the CMN doesn't put any of the AI's in a game into permanent vendetta against a human player, and that the CMN are able to discern the level of play of the human players involved and build a challenging, yet enjoyable PBEM for ALL players involved in a game, even if said human players are at different ability levels. This is what I continually strive for, and am always exploring as far as how to improve my CMN abilities, and why I ask for feedback from the players involved in games I set up.

    D

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks for the different perspective. I had largely dropped out of solo play because of the boredom issue. Have only been part of the online community for a little over a year, I don't FEEL the danger yet for PBEM, though I can certainly understand the issue all too well.

      I do agree in tailoring the game to the players and their skill levels. It's the same when being the "CMN" for role-playing games, something I've done on and off for almost thirty years. (You meet alot more ladies role-playing than in strategy gaming. ) If the players don't enjoy it, you've failed. In fact I need to check in on the three scenarios I designed and get some feedback, I am quite sure I can do a better job in the future, I'll just need the data from them.

      P.S. I don't know the #@#$% layout yet. I have the Empath Guild, and I know what each base looks like, but without a Unity Survey (i.e. Empath Guild surveying) I am clueless about the layout of anyone but Yang, who blackmailed me into exhanging maps . His defensive layout is a little weak, though his tech and support makes up for that. Plus he got the bloody Command Nexus which is going to make squeezing him much harder. I will not mention which of the other AI's got what in the base layout and in units, I'm going to let the other players find out on their own

      I still consider your handling the AI/pacts/SP's etc. nothing short of brilliant, this is going to give me the toughest AI I've ever faced (I can even out-builder the AI as Miriam in SMAX, I tried it once for a challenge - but that game was slloooowwwww). While I inherited the position from a drop-out, I'll have to admit that the Darnan fast start (implicit to the way the guy laid out his bases) really did speed up the beginning of the game, and has worked hugely to my advantage. Seeing how you've handled this definitely has me thinking out of the box.
      The worst form of insubordination is being right - Keith D., marine veteran. A dictator will starve to the last civilian - self-quoted
      And on the eigth day, God realized it was Monday, and created caffeine. And behold, it was very good. - self-quoted
      Klaatu: I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it.
      Mr. Harley: I'm afraid my people haven't. I'm very sorry… I wish it were otherwise.

      Comment


      • #4
        [plug]
        You could use ModMan if you want to change alphax settings in your pbem.
        [/plug]
        #play s.-cd#g+c-ga#+dgfg#+cf----q.c
        #endgame

        Quantum P. is a champion: http://geocities.com/zztexpert/docs/upoprgv4.html

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by shawnmmcc
          I still consider your handling the AI/pacts/SP's etc. nothing short of brilliant,
          I can't take credit for that strategy: many CMN's before me had already employed it.

          Originally posted by shawnmmcc
          I'll have to admit that the Darnan fast start really did speed up the beginning of the game
          Its Darsnan ! Anyways, yeah, giving people speeder CP's instead of regular CP's does accelerate the early game, as this phase of the game does drag a little, IMO. Just be aware that you as a CMN need to give each Faction at least one regular CP, or the game will crash, as there is some hardcoding here that says that if the game doesn't detect a regular CP on the opening turn for each Faction, the game will terminate. FYI.

          Originally posted by #endgame
          You could use ModMan if you want to change alphax settings in your pbem.
          Modman is indeed a very good tool! However, just be aware that only the #UNITS Section of the alpha(x).txt file is imprinted onto a PBEM game. FYI in case other people are using this tool for PBEM's.

          D

          Comment


          • #6
            In that case it was a typo, not the dyslexia. The Darsnan fast start.... The Planetary Datalinks in the hands of Miriam is just soooo irritating, she's grabbed an SP because of it. Coincidentally, hope your children are doing well, that's my avatar is a not very good scan of a photo of my little one that I need to update again.
            The worst form of insubordination is being right - Keith D., marine veteran. A dictator will starve to the last civilian - self-quoted
            And on the eigth day, God realized it was Monday, and created caffeine. And behold, it was very good. - self-quoted
            Klaatu: I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it.
            Mr. Harley: I'm afraid my people haven't. I'm very sorry… I wish it were otherwise.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by shawnmmcc
              hope your children are doing well, that's my avatar is a not very good scan of a photo of my little one that I need to update again.
              My youngest just started school! Whoo-hoo! I'll probably be starting a picture thread over @ CGN with some camping pics from this summer in the near future. FYI.
              How old is the picture of your little one? I know they tend to grow by leaps and bounds at that age!


              D

              Comment


              • #8
                Does that mean that if you have a morning off, and Mrs. Darsnan has the morning off, and the kids are in school... The old avatar was from one year, this new one is less than a week old - she's a little over 18 months. Still no TV, still wonderfully behaved within the context of being 18 months old. At least that's what EVERYONE tells us, and I do not exaggerate. OK, UP - we love to sit on daddy's lap when he's on the machine - she has her own old IBM keyboard she sits on, pounds on, and pries the key covers off of. That is if she cannot get on daddy's lap.
                The worst form of insubordination is being right - Keith D., marine veteran. A dictator will starve to the last civilian - self-quoted
                And on the eigth day, God realized it was Monday, and created caffeine. And behold, it was very good. - self-quoted
                Klaatu: I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it.
                Mr. Harley: I'm afraid my people haven't. I'm very sorry… I wish it were otherwise.

                Comment

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