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  • Pollute the World sink everything

    Has anyone won a "Pacifist" victory by sinking all the enemy factions' bases? That or had native take the last enemy base. I've seen the AI decimated by global warming and natives, but never seen them finished off/eradicated. I plan to win by sinking everyone into oblivion. I did pretty well my last Morgan game. Spartans build a scary army and I sunk it until I could corner the energy market. I know the fastest I've even trigger the "growth dream" was with Yang. Yet, it seems big bases do more damage to the environment. In short, how do I do as much damage to the environment as possible? I was thinking of using supply crawlers, bore holes, and condensers with the weather paragrim. There is a lot of nuances to this game with terraforming, for a example a forest can decrease your food production on a rainy rolling tile. In general big bases seem to do the most damage, for example as the Morgans I captured Gaia's landing, surrounded by forests and yet it had the highest eco damage due to having the highest population. I think I'll try one super large city via population boom + supply crawlers. Lets see if I can build a city size 255. Might even be a valid strategy, can you imagine one huge city with every secret project built? Could generate a lot of research/money especially if its your capital, no waste.

  • #2
    I have never tried sinking everything but it could be a little hard, but a good exercise.

    Certain bases will get auto-pressure domes when you perform a sink operation. I'm not sure how exactly it happens but if I read the Terraform Down part of the former operation, it says it will lower the terrain by about 1000 meters. If the base is at 1200 meters high, I'm thinking the remainder 200 meters somehow factors in.

    Certainly, you'd be in a position to find out. Make a Standard Map with 70-90% ocean coverage to help you out.

    BTW, a forest on a arid + flat, arid + rolling, moist + flat, moist + rolling, rainy + flat or rainy + rolling all gives you 1-2-1 by default. Tree Farms make that 2-2-1 and the Hybrid Forest makes it 3-2-2. Monsoon Jungle makes the regular forest into a 2-2-1 (which is why it is *excellent* in the early game), the Uranium Flats & Pholus Ridge make forest into 1-2-2. The Garland Crater makes forest into 1-3-1.

    Early game I put forest on MJ and then plop Tree Farm facilities, in the GC I use farm+solar (2-2-1) and drill rivers in the inner core which makes it 2-2-2, fairly good early game. Then once I unlock Tree Farms I put forest everywhere. The GC is nice for SPs because with Hybrid Forests in the middle + rivers nets you 3-3-3 each square, 3-3-5 if you have +2 Econ and Merchant Exchange.

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    • #3
      I just tried sinking the world with the Hive, I failed miserably, I couldn't even do a single point of eco damage for over an hour. I built some boreholes, but only produced 2 minerals and 2 energy, couldn't figure out why.

      "Early game I put forest on MJ and then plop Tree Farm facilities, in the GC I use farm+solar (2-2-1) and drill rivers in the inner core which makes it 2-2-2, fairly good early game. Then once I unlock Tree Farms I put forest everywhere. The GC is nice for SPs because with Hybrid Forests in the middle + rivers nets you 3-3-3 each square, 3-3-5 if you have +2 Econ and Merchant Exchange."

      I never really tried to exploit the early game landmarks. I'm usually too busy conquering/defending.

      "BTW, a forest on a arid + flat, arid + rolling, moist + flat, moist + rolling, rainy + flat or rainy + rolling all gives you 1-2-1 by default."

      I thought maybe a default was being hit. Keep coming up with the same amount resources for different terrain with forests. Seems best for those arid flatlands. Seems a waste on the rainy lands.

      I'm trying Brother Lal now and setting a bunch of formers to fungcidial, that will shortly cause global warming, got over 30 formers already.

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      • #4
        Forests add to ecodamage some, but Tree Farms and Hybrid Forests reduce ecodamage a lot.
        I am on a mission to see how much coffee it takes to actually achieve time travel. :frantic:

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        • #5
          Just got pretty far with Brother Lal with minimum spacing between cities + lots and lots of formers on Alien Crossfire. Worked great, used terraformers to level rocky areas and clear fungus so I could land colony pods where I wanted it to. From looking at the AI though this isn't how the game is supposed to be played. The AI sets its bases far apart and uses far less terraformers. Anyways I was lagging a little with my over 50 terraformers on automove, then blue screen crash.

          I did like the concept though of using the + talents and hab limit with brother lal to get lots of bases up to size 9 using +6 to pop. growth. Children's creche +2 and +4 from Social engineering. Had a lot of +3 lab specialists and was researching every 5 turns. From what I've seen what works best if the game didn't crash would be spamming bases only 2 apart. Since that crashes the game I'm going to go with what I did before,

          A. cities optimally spaced, 5 spaces apart, and hope the stupid AI doesn't break through my defense lines.
          B. Build a few colonies wherever, and then conquer like crazy.

          Either way if you let the game go to where the AI gets airplanes your likely to crash the game, something about interceptor planes scrambling. Though too much automation in general seems to cause problems. AI loves to try to send land units across ocean sqares. Either way try to keep as little units/cities on the board. Also, automation to a minimal seems to solve 75% of these problems. Also you tend to play better under manual control.

          In short, spam terraformers + cities and you crash the game. I"m going to try to eliminate all fungus with forests/kelp farms next game. Muwhahaha, that will surely cause global warming. Also, its hard to do much eco damage without tech. Its not really to genejack factory + hybrid tree farm that I usually start doing 20+ eco damage.

          "Forests add to ecodamage some, but Tree Farms and Hybrid Forests reduce ecodamage a lot."

          I love it pollute the world with forests! The self propgating forests will spread throughout the world, destroying it!

          Quick update:

          Started a new game Talent University map of planet. Made a minimum amount of terraformers, about 1 per base with optimal city spacing, each city gets all 21 squares. Doing awesome, it really pays to build scout patrol, recycling tanks, children's creche, terraformer. Then, any and all psych buildings. That way you can stay in a golden age. Democracy + free market + wealth + children's creche means population boom + intellectual golden age. What more can I say?

          By turn 152, planet year 2252 I have fusion power, traded for tree farm, and stole hybrid tree farm tech from Lady Deidre. Despite having way more trees than Deidre, she hates me. She must want all my trees for herself. I couldn't plant the forests fast enough, and before I could turn around blam, I already have tree farm, my economy is about to explode, and I already have breakthroughs every 4 turns. Sure, I have three factions at war with me, but they are also at war each other.

          Forests are the way to go, they give the most benefit for the least cost. For only 4 turns of terraforming you can get many forests, opposed to 10 turns for solar collector + farms. That way you can build less transformers and build more probe teams and infrastructure/military. By, the time you pollute the world with trees you already have tree farms!
          Last edited by ReconRoverRush; February 3, 2014, 08:04. Reason: Update, didn't want to bump post

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          • #6
            You have to unlock "restrictions" before you can get more than 2 of a resource.

            To get more than 2 food per square, you need Gene Splicing.
            To get more than 2 minerals per square, you need Ecological Engineering.
            To get more than 2 energy per square, you need Environmental Economics.

            Excepts: Bonus resource squares, and I think if you have the WP and pop condensors down, you can get 4 nutrients before GS. Bonus squares and base squares are not subject to resource restrictions. Otherwise, a borehole will produce a max of 2 minerals and 2 energy, but if you have appropriated the appropriate techs, you can get a max of 8 minerals and 10 energy from a borehole (assuming a borehole on a mineral bonus square in the Uranium Flats, plus a river, and the Merchant Exchange for the base working the square and +2 Econ on the SE table).

            The most you're going to see from a land square for nutrients is condensor+nutrient bonus+farm+soil enricher+Monsoon Jungle for a net nutrient value of 8 nutrients.

            Here's how I do terraforming (I am not a Builder type and I hate working with formers at home when I could be conquering abroad):
            1) Early game:
            a) Rainy + rolling squares get just a solar collector. That produces 2-1-1 or 2-1-2 depending on the square. Later on you can add a farm but until you get Gene Splicing there's no point in adding a farm.
            b) Moist + rolling squares get a farm and solar collector. You *NEED* these to help your city grow.
            c) Any other square except bonus squares get a forest. Good for early game minerals, as in, all you're going to get.
            d) Resource bonus squares:
            aa) Nutrient: Farm plus solar. If it's an arid square, I put a forest. 3-2-1 instantly. Grows the city and pumps in minerals. If it's rocky, terraform it level.
            bb) Mineral: Farm plus solar. If it's arid, forest. 1-4-1 easy. If it's rocky, add road+mine for an instant 6 minerals.
            cc) Energy: Farm plus solar, unless it's arid, in which case I put a forest.
            2) Mid game: Forest everywhere. Once the forestation is done I start putting boreholes down. All rocky squares get a road+mine for 4 minerals and get a crawler. Usually each base gets two boreholes. Once I get Monopole Magnets I add magtubes. Sometimes near land where the enemy might attack I add road+sensor+forest+bunker and stick a 1-6-1*2 AAA ECM garrison along with a 13-1-2*2 SAM rover.
            3) Late game: Nothing. Formers are in bases sleeping.

            Here's how I play the first ten or so turns:

            1) If I'm Zak, I research Social Psych (free tech), then Biogenetics, then Secrets of the Human Brain, then with the free tech that comes with SHB (D2) I get Centarui Ecology.
            2) Otherwise, Centarui Ecology right away. If Deidre, Biogenetics.
            3) Send the rover (sparta is what I usually play) to nearby pods, hoping for monoliths. (Two monoliths + nutrient bonus = awesome colony pod base)
            4) After the scout patrol is built, start working on a colony pod.
            5) When Centauri Ecology is finished, usually before 10 minerals have been accumulated, switch production to Formers. Rush the last 8 minerals or so.
            6) With the former: If there is a nearby (adjacent to base) bonus square, move to there first. Otherwise, move to an arid square, preferably flat. Build a road, then a sensor, then a forest. Then move to any nearby bonus squares, and apply the logic shown earlier: otherwise, move to the first moist-rolling square and plop down a farm+solar.
            7) If Spartan and there is company, or think there is company nearby, gun for Nonlinear Mathematics (Applied Physics, Information Networks). Build a command center. Then start building the world's FIRST Elite Impact Rover. Booyah. (Sparta + command center + first production unit + monolith = Elite) Build about six of these bad boys and start hunting. If opposition is believed to be stiff (Believers, Hive) then I wait until I build Impact Squads (4-3-1) for backup and main attack. (If Hive, wait until Probe teams come available.) Otherwise, sit back and start picking techs that will help me grab SPs. The only early game SPs I care about are: 1) Command Nexus, 2) Weather Paradigm, 3) Virtual World, 4) Citizens' Defense Force. The Human Genome Project and Merchant Exchange are of secondary importance (I will build them if I have time though) but I never build the Planetary Transit System (unless I'm Lal and gunning for Diplomatic victory, because it lets me build up bases fast) or that other SP that lets you discover tech held by any other three factions.

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            • #7
              "You have to unlock "restrictions" before you can get more than 2 of a resource.

              To get more than 2 food per square, you need Gene Splicing.
              To get more than 2 minerals per square, you need Ecological Engineering.
              To get more than 2 energy per square, you need Environmental Economics."

              Ahhh, the bonus nutrient/energy/minerals squares was throwing me off. A new game I started with Planet Cult had a rocky mineral mine. I was getting 7 production. I was confused, I figured it had something to do with my +2 planet score.

              Btw, by turn 220 or so I sunk two bases. The problem was it backfired and sunk most of my forests. To make matters worse the planet kept sending in lots and lots of natives including spore launchers. The spore launchers would get stranded on little islands between my bases and bombard all day long. On the + side I researched every tech by turn 250 or so. Researching 2 techs before reaching end of tech line. So ultimately I failed to sink the world before I would have won through transcendence, the fastest victory usually. Yang had 30% of the votes, and required 25k for corner energy market, so no diplomatic or economic victory. Conquest takes forever because surrendered nations keep declaring vendetta upon you.

              In short, forests + research ftw. Lady Deidre kept burning my forests, but they kept regrowing, same with spore launchers.

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