Game crashes when turn ends

[rod87]

Hi again!

I've taken a glance at the bug fixing thread (first 3 pages or so), but I honestly don't have the time or patience to read the entire thread, no offence intended. I really do appreciate that after so many years efforts are still being put into solving some of this game's bugs.

My problem is as follows. A couple of days ago I started a Spartan SMAX game in a customized random map (I mean, I could select the % of water, cloud cover, native life etc, leaving most in average), in Specialist difficulty, against the other 6 original factions. Sharing my starting continent with the Gaians, the Peacekeepers and the University, I eventually beat the Gaians into submission, while keeping excellent relations with the other two factions (I guess it's because of the low difficulty setting). After that I made contact with Yang and Morgan, who was being crushed by Yang. I beat Morgan and made him my vassal, and after a few turns, prepared for the eventual global war against Yang.

I liberated Miriam from Yang's HQ, thus starting the war. Then I started sending choppers and a few rovers in a transport to capture his bases, asking the Gaians and Morgan for support (even though I didn't need it). And now, at a certain point after taking his HQ and another base, whenever I click End Turn, the game crashes. A 'flashing' (on and off, in intervals of about 3 seconds) hourglass appears near the cursor, and then the game crashes.

If this bug is already being discussed, or has been solved by any means, I kindly ask you to redirect me, and delete this thread if necessary, I'm sorry if I'm causing any trouble.

I also have the save file at hand, and can upload it if anyone wants to take a look. I'm playing the SMAX version, with the latest patch applied (2.0 I think) and the NoCD (just for convenience, as I don't want to swap CDs with RomeTW; I have the SoldOut version), in Windows XP.

[BlackCat]

Sounds like an interesting new way to get the game crash - please post a save of the game.

[rod87]

Sparta.zip

I hope I did it right, it's my first try attaching a file.

[BlackCat]

Yep, you did it right

Your problem is a variant of another bug where one of the AI's frees another captured leader from another AI resulting in that all the human players colonies dissapears and you are left with two colony pods and a scout.

In your case reestblish of the belivers on the map apperently results in a crash. If I went to the scenario editor (ctrl+k) and removed them, the game doesn't crash. Lesson - don't free other faction leaders

[rod87]

Well thanks!

I do remember though that the very first time I did it, Miriam respawned in that small island near my Eastern sea base. She had a rover, but I couldn't see her base, because I didn't bother exploring the island with a nearby chopper, I just thought she would be alright by herself. The very next turn, she got into a war with the Peacekeepers with no apparent reason (go figure :P) and the base she had there was captured by them, effectively re-eradicating her. However, I had a crash a few turns after that (after I had captured 2 more of Yang's bases, I thought in this save I had already got one of those) and as I hadn't saved for a while, I had to load to the save I uploaded here, finding this crash, which hadn't happened before.

I really like the option to free captured leaders, but it seems it isn't that well implemented. I wonder what happens if you free a captured leader and there is no space left in the map that is not claimed by anyone.

Can anything be done to keep playing without editing the scenario or using cheats anyway?

[Petek]

To continue playing, contact Miriam and gift her one of your worst bases. Admiralty Base looks like a good choice, but whatever you like. After doing so, for some reason, the game now proceeds without crashing. Also, did you give Miriam all your research? She has all your techs.

[rod87]

Thanks! I'll try that next time. Is it advisable to do that whenever you liberate a faction leader? Does that always prevent the bug?

And yes, I did give her all my research. I did the same with Morgan and Deirdre, even giving them their bases back, just so they could be more helpful as my vassals. I know I shouldn't because now they can make some of the Secret Projects I want (and it's already happened), but I have such a crushing lead in everything else that I just don't care. Maybe I should try a higher difficulty setting :P

[Petek]

Thanks! I'll try that next time. Is it advisable to do that whenever you liberate a faction leader? Does that always prevent the bug?

And yes, I did give her all my research. I did the same with Morgan and Deirdre, even giving them their bases back, just so they could be more helpful as my vassals. I know I shouldn't because now they can make some of the Secret Projects I want (and it's already happened), but I have such a crushing lead in everything else that I just don't care. Maybe I should try a higher difficulty setting :P

I don't know what causes this bug and I don't know why gifting a base fixes it. I found other ways to avoid the crash, but they involved using the scenario editor, which you didn't want to use. So, I'd suggest not gifting a base in the future, unless the game crashes. I'll post this problem on the forum where the bug fix project moved. Perhaps it can be fixed.

[BlackCat]

@rod87 - listen to Petek, he is a wise man, though, he sleeps too little (sorry Petek, couldn't resist ).

If you don't mind, I would like to propose a couple of minor changes in you strategies.

First, I don't know if you are familiar with the term "clean minerals". If not, then it means that after you have had a fungus pop due to Eco-damage, then every treefarm, hybrid forest, centauri preserve and temple of planet build after this pop, raises the amount of mins that you can produce without causing eco-damage.

Build Assembly plants in all colonies and use some of all those credits you have to hurry them. Do the same with nanoreplicators when the becomes available. Hurry tree farms and hybrid ditto - it's costly but pays in the long run.

You are building The Living Refinery witch is fine since it adds two to support, but you are building clean units, so it's a bit of waste. There are at least four other projects that gives more benefits :

Cloning Vats : combine that with sky hydroponics and power transmitters and your economic and research will go through the roof.

Nano factory : cheap upgrade.

Cyborg factory : better units.

Xenoempathy dome : better maneuvrability for your troops.

Universal translator: two free techs, but it's more important when you have acces to alien arefacts.

Use crawlers to hurry your secret projects - in that way you can have say four colonies to add mins to a project.

On the offensive side, may I suggest drop hovertanks ? Combined with choppers to clear the way, you can do a lot of damage. Note, build hand weapon no special hovertanks and upgrade these - with Nano factory and your income, it's quite cheap.

Last, get up more power transmitters and sky hydroponics - they are worth the effort (with cloning wats, go for max pop, without go for average colony pop.

You seem to make all your units clean. That is a bit of waste since you as Spartans has two support free units per base. If you have city defender and one or two formers nonclean, it's fine (make the formers super and fungicidal instead).

All of the above applies to the current situation, but might give you some ideas how to deal with the game at higher difficulties.

Hope I haven't offended you and spoiled the game for you

[rod87]

Thanks to both for solving that problem in less than... 2 days? Amazing! I actually tried giving her Admiralty Base, and it didn't crash, I just hope Miriam doesn't get into trouble...

Regarding the advice, I'm not offended, it's actually nice to see someone make the effort of revising a save game and giving advice on what and how to improve.

I already knew most of those things (hurrying up, using crawlers to speed up secret projects, ecology), but at that stage in the game, as you can see, I'm just being lazy. Otherwise I would have never let myself get to such astronomical energy levels unless I was planning on getting an economic victory (which I'm actually not interested in). At this point I just want to crush the Hive into submission, and then do the same to Lal and Zakharov. I just want to see if that counts as a conquest victory (please don't spoil this for me), since I've never achieved one; otherwise I'll just go for my usual diplomatic victory.

I'm curious about some things, though. You mention that building those eco-friendly facilities after that event (the 'something goes 'pop' ' one?) raises the minerals I get. Does that mean that the same improvements, built before that event, don't give as much minerals as after?

My main offensive strategy is attacking with copters (since they can attack several times per turn) until a city has no defenders left, and then sweep in with a rover. But it would actually be a good idea to design them with no weapons and maybe even no armor, and just make them with drop pods to speed up the process - but I have a doubt, do drop pods allow you to drop anywhere in the planet or does it have a limited range?

Regarding clean units, I know the Spartans have the support bonus, it's just that I'd rather pay the small price of making all my units clean (even with the industry penalty) if that means I can just spam them from a few bases without worrying about the toll they're taking in mineral production with their added support.

I also had a doubt regarding satellites. Is there a limit to the amount you can make where they no longer offer any benefits?

And also, are difficulty levels progressively hard, or is there one (or more) in particular with a steep and sudden difficulty curve?

Thanks in advance

[BlackCat]

I'm curious about some things, though. You mention that building those eco-friendly facilities after that event (the 'something goes 'pop' ' one?) raises the minerals I get. Does that mean that the same improvements, built before that event, don't give as much minerals as after?

Well, that wasn't probably the best formulated part I'll try to clarify. First, no, there are no difference in min production. When you start to get eco damage due to high min prod and terraforming, you get a fungus growth. If you wait to build the mentioned improvements to after such a growth, the effect of mineral production will be reduced with the number of such buildings. Said another way, you can produce more mins without causing eco damage. Further, it's ALL these buildings that count at each base. Say, you have ten bases each having tree farm and hybrid forest, you have 20 "clean" mins at each individual base.

My main offensive strategy is attacking with copters (since they can attack several times per turn) until a city has no defenders left, and then sweep in with a rover. But it would actually be a good idea to design them with no weapons and maybe even no armor, and just make them with drop pods to speed up the process - but I have a doubt, do drop pods allow you to drop anywhere in the planet or does it have a limited range?

There is nothing wrong with your chopper/rover tactic, but there are a couple of problems. You have to clear the road for the rovers, have to pass fungus, rocky terrain etc to get in position.

With drop ability, all you have to do is kill defenders and let the drop unit land beside and enter. Best part is that it's instantly repaired (making drops damage the unit). After that you can drop units directly to the city without damage.

Until the Space Elevator there is a max range of 8 - after that you can drop everywhere.

On higher difficulties, you certainly want to have heavy armour and guns on these drop units, otherwise enemy missiles, airforces and ground units will kill them .

I also had a doubt regarding satellites. Is there a limit to the amount you can make where they no longer offer any benefits?

Yep, there is a limit - population number in a city. Say, you have one base with a pop of 7 and nine bases with a pop of 3, it makes sense to only send up three instead of 7. Though, if you have cloning vats, you want to crank out enough to match pop growth.

And also, are difficulty levels progressively hard, or is there one (or more) in particular with a steep and sudden difficulty curve?

Thanks in advance

I've been playing on trancend for almost ten years, so I can't really recall how the difficulty changed. If I should choose one, then it would be Citizen - figuring out how to play the game was quite hard

There are a summary on levels here : link

[rod87]

Well thanks for everything! I think that solves most of my doubts.

Regarding satellites I don't think the limit was explained in the Datalinks, maybe it was in the manual but I couldn't find it anywhere in there. It just seemed unfair that you could just use one base to continuously spam satellites that would constantly improve each and every one of your bases with no limits.

[BlackCat]

Well, you were on the right road to loosing lots of sleep, so I don't mind helping you

I guess that you already know that there are no stupid questions, just stupid answers, so don't hesitate

[scient]

Just thought I'd pop by and let folks know I've fixed this crash. See this thread for more details. Interestingly enough, it has nothing to do with freeing a faction (which had its own set of problems I've already fixed) but the Believers trying to upgrade their units. Giving her all your research in conjunction with Believers having no bases (among other faction specific settings, see CGN thread) set up perfect conditions to trigger this rare crash. At the moment, best solution would be to give one of your bases to Believers which you've already done. Anyway, fix for this crash will be included in next unofficial patch release for SMAC/SMAX.

[Myrth]

May I still post in this topic or must I start a new one for issue with crash after end of turn?

PS
OK, I guess I've figured out what's wrong by plain accident. But why attack on AI's headquarters by wild mindworms ends with a crash?