Sparta the Builder

[CEO Aaron]

I've been messing around a great deal with the Spartans lately. While no one can contest their ease of exploration and tough troops, I'm finding them exceedingly difficult to play in a more Hybrid style. At first glance, they seem well-adapted to Hybrid play. They can pop boom, their police rating makes for easy drone control. But the problem plaguing me is that in order to really get their tech competitive, I have to run Free Market, which obviates any advantage the innate police rating plays.

So, for you Sparta fans, what is your overall strategy when you can't just roll a neighbor and take their bases? In what order do you research techs, and what Secret Projects do you aim for? I know there's got to be some better tactics out there than mine.

[sir_schwick]

Probes with Fundy? The morale boost will also allow you to take on more technological disparate battles. Without their precious Perimeter Defense and by stealing their Chaos guns you can still force them to give you techs for peace.

[CEO Aaron]

So your recommendation is to eschew peaceful coexistence and ruthlessly probe the AI for every tech they've got. I suppose there's merit in that notion, it's not like my economy is such that the trade dividend.

I suspect that may be my problem, as I tend to explore very methodically and focus primarily on the construction of my bases, being a builder at heart.

[sir_schwick]

As I have noticed it;

If you do not have a competitive advantage in direct research, then you usually have the competitive advantage in probing.

However Spartans main issue with being a Builder is the Industry-. You can never compete with other Hybrid builders, but you can stay middle of the pack. This works if you have a decent sized force that is waiting to be upgraded. Then whenever you get lucky and trade/research a critical military tech, you can probably roll them. If not completely then enough to get more techs to catch up. I always play blind research so I really recommend Conquer. Secret Projects I have no idea on for Spartans.

[Maniac]

Forget about FM. As you say, it negates your biggest builder advantage.

Don't try ICSing either past the early game phase. Sure, the extra police makes it easier, but you won't be running FM+Wealth, so you won't benefit from extra energy on the base square.

Finding an easy victim to gobble early on and get some techs from is the key the victory. However while it won't be as easy, you can play Sparta as a builder. Then it's all about popbooming popbooming popbooming. After the Peacekeepers they're the easiest faction to do this with. Remember: due to your +1 Police you can easily get rid of four more drones than a Free Marketeer can.

Popbooming means you'll be running Demo/Planned basically all the time. It also means your tech priorities aren't all that different from those of everyone else. Ethical Calculus->Gene Splicing->EcoEng->EnvEcon is still the golden path. Likewise, Synthetic Fossil Fuels, D:AP and MMI are as important as ever, and are on the tech path you're following for your builder needs anyway.

There are some minor differences though.

Industrial Automation isn't as important early on for Sparta as for other factions. You can't run Wealth. It takes a while before Hab Complexes becomes useful. That leaves crawlers. Even then, it's possible to play a Spartan game without using a single crawler.
The uses of crawlers are:
1) crawling rocky mined squares (though this use only kicks in after you have EcoEng)
2) crawling some food for a base that can't reach a two food surplus. (again, this use only kicks after you have some popbooming techs)
3) designing some superexpensive unit to maximally profit from materials pods. Handy for instant secret projects. A 0-2-2 crawler gives 10 rows. A 0-2t-2 crawlers gives 15 rows, but SotHB should only be researched to get to Neural Grafting. Though if you can trade the tech from someone, definitely do. However once again, there are good alternatives to maximally profit from materials pods. A sea former, sea colony pod, research hospital... All nice things to have, stuff you normally wouldn't build due to their high cost.
In short, you only really need IndEcon and IndBase because they're a prerequisite for EnvEcon. So IndAut can perfectly wait until after EnvEcon.

Doctrine: Flexibility. This should be one of your first techs. You'd be surprised how profitable pod popping is. Just make sure to avoid the IoDs. Always make sure you have four movement points before popping a pod, so that you can always run safely away.

Your early exploration will also mean you'll meet all the other factions earlier than everyone else. As a consequence you can act as a tech broker, partially making up for your own early lack of research.

Applied Physics->NonlMath is important, but of course only if you have early war plans.

Doctrine:Loyalty->Intellectual Integrity is much more important for Sparta than for other factions. The reason: Nonlethal Methods. If you want, you can pick up the Command Nexus and CDF along the way.

Once you have Intellectual Integrity, it's only one tech further to Cyberethics. Once again more important for Sparta than for other factions. Knowledge SE! Since obviously you won't be running Wealth or Power (unless you have the Cloning Vats). The tech also gives Planetary Datalinks. Definitely useful in multiplayer. Probably less so against the AI.

Provided you have researched NonlMath earlier on, with Cyberethics it's only one step further to Superstring Theory. Most players will stick to Missile Launchers for a loooooong time, so this gives you an even bigger military lead.

Your extra morale also gives you a small builder benefit btw. IIRC non-military units also get an extra movement point if they're elite. For other factions this is impossible to achieve without SE, because monoliths don't work on non-mil units. But Sparta doesn't need them! So with a Command Center and Bioenhancement Center, your formers will have two movement points.

Planetary Economics with Ascetic Virtues is also very neat.


Generally speaking about their popbooming, since you won't be running FM, you don't need to make extensive preparations before making a temporary FM->Planned switch, like other factions would. You can already start some limited popbooming in certain bases as soon you have Ethical Calculus/Gene Splicing. Eg build some farms/solar collectors on rainy squares above 1000m, and turn the extra population into librarians.

You're unlikely to get it, but if you could get the Weather Paradigm, you're golden of course. It's biggest advantage is not the former speed boost, but the fact that you can build condensers and surpass the nutrient limit. Gene/EcoEng/EnvEcon then loses much of its value.

That's it. Hope it's of some use.

[CEO Aaron]

Great advice. I started a new Sparta game, got far more aggressive about my probe rape and pod popping, with joyous results.

I do tend to be greedy about sea pods, and try only to open them with transports, so as not to waste potential artifacts. Do other people bother with this, or am I hosing myself by getting units when I could just have more credits and tech?

I did completely bypass Industrial Automation, not getting it until I stole it from Morgan, and while I feel it cost me some early Secret Projects, I do feel like I'm in a stronger position to go grab them with military action, or just do without them. Quelling 6 drones with only police and commons is a wonderful thing.

Oh, and one other fantastic advantage of the popbooming builder Spartan: You almost can't avoid being Governor.

[Maniac]

Originally posted by CEO Aaron
I do tend to be greedy about sea pods, and try only to open them with transports, so as not to waste potential artifacts. Do other people bother with this, or am I hosing myself by getting units when I could just have more credits and tech?

Hard to say. I think except for transports getting 10 to 15% artifacts from unity pods, the pod popping results from trannies and gun foils are the same. I'll attach some testing data from a couple years ago for the record.

Though trannies get better pod popping results, keep in mind that they have a higher chance of being attacked by IoDs, that if they have an artifact they need to spend precious time shipping it back home instead of exploring further, that they cost more to build, and that they move slower. This is costing you comparative turn advantage, which is especially important early in the game. So I'd say definitely make your first two sea explorers gun foils, not transports.
It's hard to quantify what's best, but IIRC for the reasons mentioned above myself I didn't build transports for pod popping, even beyond the first two explorers. Go gun foils!

In any case, the biggest reason for pod popping the sea are not artifacts, but materials pods.

Oh, and one other fantastic advantage of the popbooming builder Spartan: You almost can't avoid being Governor.

Ah yes true too. And since you're the first to meet all six other factions, you get the pick the most opportune moment to call a meeting.

Edit: Woops, forgot about the test sample:
(Pod popping became a science during ACDG3 )

Unity foil, Pod on shelf

native: 13
kelp: 10
materials: 7
artifact: 6
sonar: 6
clone: 2
25c: 2
50c: 1
100c: 1
foil: 1
tech: 1
50


Unity foil, Pod on fungus

native: 12
materials: 9
kelp: 8
sonar: 5
artifact: 5
100c: 3
75c: 2
25c: 2
tech: 2
50c: 1
commlink: 1
50


Unity foil, Pod in trench

native: 20
artifact: 7
sonar: 6
materials: 5
75c: 4
50c: 3
commlink: 2
foil: 2
tech: 1
50

Gun foil, Pod in trench

native: 19
sonar: 15
materials: 7
25c: 3
100c: 2
75c: 2
50c: 1
commlink: 1
50


Gun foil, Pod on shelf

native: 11
kelp: 10
sonar: 9
materials: 6
50c: 5
100c: 3
75c: 2
25c: 2
commlink: 1
tech: 1
50

Gun foil, Pod on fungus

native: 14
kelp: 11
sonar: 10
commlink: 4
100c: 4
materials: 3
75c: 2
50c: 1
25c: 1
50

[CEO Aaron]

So what's the sample rate on the pod popping numbers? It seems pretty irregular, as if we're looking at a small sample size.

Nevertheless, you've convinced me on gun foils. 33% faster speed, the ability to operate independently without less fear of IODs, and the cheaper cost to build/replace more than makes up for the inability to capture artifacts at sea.

I still like having a couple transports going, since I can load up a rover and grab coastal pods on unexplored landmasses risk-free.

[Maniac]

Originally posted by CEO Aaron
So what's the sample rate on the pod popping numbers? It seems pretty irregular, as if we're looking at a small sample size.

6*50 tries. It should have been more tries to know for sure, but that would take an insane amount of time.

I still like having a couple transports going, since I can load up a rover and grab coastal pods on unexplored landmasses risk-free.

Ah yes you're right I did that too. Don't build the trannies specificially for pod popping, but build them to drop a rover off elsewhere or transport it all over the place, and pop a pod here and there as a side-benefit.

Other possibility is sending your earliest gun foils off in some far direction instead of first exploring the area immediately around you. That way there might still be some pods close to you for later trannies to pop. However that of course carries the risk some other faction pops the pod before you.

[CEO Aaron]

Yeah, I'm enough of a believer in turn advantage to just get the goodies in the pods now, rather than wait an arbitrary amount of time in hopes of a tech or 50 minerals many turns later. Heck, 20 ECs from blowing up a IOD and worm is plenty good enough early in the game. And as you say, unpopped pods can still be snaked by rival factions.

[Maniac]

For the record, I very rarely attacked IoDs with gun foils. I just ran away as fast as I could, for which the extra move compared to a trannie is very useful. Psi combat on the sea is 1 vs 1. Even with better morale, the odds for victory still aren't exactly splendid. Plus consider that after an attack, you need to spend turns healing instead of exploring further. Again a loss of turn advantage. So just forget about the 20 credits and make sure you live to see another day and pop another pod.

[CEO Aaron]

Aren't the odds pretty good the IOD is gonna come rock you anyway? At least you're close to even odds when you attack. Defend, and you're dead.

[Maniac]

At least you're close to even odds when you attack. Defend, and you're dead.

On land you should of course attack any and all native life in sight. But IIRC the combat odds of offense and defense are exactly the same in the sea. Naval unit psi combat is one vs one.

Originally posted by CEO Aaron
Aren't the odds pretty good the IOD is gonna come rock you anyway?

There is a pattern to how IoDs move. If they don't have any hostile unit (that is, you) in their sight, they will move to the closest inhabitated landmass (unless there's no faction at all in a wide vicinity - then IIRC they'll just move to the closest landmass) to drop off their load of mind worms. So the trick is using your two remaining movement points* to move your foil out of the path the IoD is most likely to travel. Once you get a feel for it, you'll very rarely if ever lose a unit to an IoD popped from a pod.

* I can't stress how important it is to only pop a pod when you have your full four movement points!!!

[Hydro]

I always pair my transport sea pod poppers with an empath 1-1-4 foil. I almost enjoy getting a hostile IoD since, often as not, it has MWs or spoor launchers aboard. Kill the loaded IoD and you kill them too, netting 80+ credits. One kill and you've paid for the empath foil. It will take a while to repair the foil, but so be it.

Moreover, if you're Green you get a chance of capturing the pod-released IoD when you attack with the empath 1-1-4 foil, which is a real boon. Captured IoDs are muich better at carrying back sea artifacts to your waiting Nodes. It doesn't take long before you've got quite a few IoDs when you're Green. You have to be careful not to attack with them when you leave Green, however, since sea psi combat has no attacker advantage. I still pair empath foils with my IoDs since conventional units have a better chance of capture, and when Green the empath foil can generally kill the hostile IoD with minimal damage.

I also like to put probes on my IoDs and transports, pull up to a pod by land, and pop it. If I get worms I jump back on the transport. If I'm unlucky and get an earthquake the transport is toast, but that's rare. If I have MW on my Isle I dump them to troll for pods and worms to get energy.

This can work very well for any faction, but builders are well suited since you've got lots of Nodes to link you're artifacts to (bumping your effective tech rate even more) and the energy can be used for all sorts of things.

Hydro

[Maniac]

Originally posted by Hydro
I always pair my transport sea pod poppers with an empath 1-1-4 foil.
...
This can work very well for any faction

With Sparta you should already have popped every sea pod in existence in the game by the time you get Centauri Empathy.

Anyway, when do you research CentEmp with the Spartans (or any faction for that matter - I very rarely used Green, and if I did, only in the late game)? For Sparta, if I had to choose between SotHB->CentEmp or DocLoy->IntInt, I'd know which one to pick.