when, generally, are you finished with your first SP?

[BlackCat]

I may have missed something, but how do you do the upgrade trick in the first 20-30 years ?

Another point is that I'm just as curious as others to how the hell Shawnmmcc was able to do that trick with three SP's in 22 turns. Even with early meeting with other factions and knowledge exchange, it would be hard to get sufficient tech knowledge for three SP's.

[Commy]

Biogenics, Centauri Ecology, and Industrial Base...three SPs, three techs...although really, I think that's still quite a stretch...

Then again, people have transcended around 2150...

[Lazerus]

transcending at 2150 was a rather "cheat" map though, everything perfectly setup for it. 2200 is a more accurate description of a fast transcend i'd say

[Archaic]

Fastest transcend I've managed on a Huge map (DDUBM to be specific) was 2199, though I'm not sure if using that map rather than a random one disqualifies it.

I'd usually finish my first project between 2125 and 2140, depending on pod pops, and number of other factions met (for economy reasons more than anything else). I don't tend to use the crawler upgrade trick, mainly because I tend to have several bases at that point which I've already built every available facility (minus tree farms anyway, which I hold off on until the first pop), and can simply pump out crawlers with. I haven't done any calculations on it or anything, but it seems to me more value for money to rush several basic crawlers rather than upgrading one crawler slightly.

[H0bbes]

Originally posted by Flubber



If you have crawlers, you can make your base nearest the pod to be popped start building an extremely expensive crawler. Later in the game it can be half the cost or more of an SP. If you don't have crawlers, you can do the same thing with units ( an armored seaformer can get quite expensive-- you just fool around and try to make the most expensive unit possible) you just accept the fact that you lose a lot of minerals when you disband them.

To get that many SPs that early, he may have beelined to crawlers, been disbanding units heavily AND hit a few AAs or instabuilds in the pod lotto

Hi.
I took over from Shawn in this game a few weeks ago & admit to being a bit puzzled- and impressed!, myself. I am certain that Flubber is correct, as when I examined the game Shawn had a lot of weird armoured units- formers, transports etc., designed.
There are definitely disadvantages to such single-mindedness; few units, few defenses, only 4 bases or something if I remember correctly. The PK AI probed one of the bases away & I just got it back when I built my first impact unit last turn.

Hobbes

[Sikander]

Playing Single Player I tend to wait a bit and build crawlers, as in the long run they help me more than any SP. I usually build my first SP in the 2140-50 range, and typically in response to the AI starting to build one I want themselves.

[binTravkin]

hmmm, I've been playing with the PKers lately, and even with with 1 spaced ICS

A really bad idea actually.

They're the best popboomers.

I examined the game Shawn had a lot of weird armoured units- formers, transports etc., designed.

Yes, Shawn may have been the best player I've ever met.
The thing is he built LOADS of explorers early and popped lots of pods, ALWAYS used instabuild for the most expensive unit he could design.
In that way he can disband a couple of very expensive units along with AAs and ECs gotten from pod popping and killing worms on an SP.

Sad thing he has departed from our commune..
(he was my friend and said he could be coming back by the end of the year though).

[Chaos Theory]

Originally posted by binTravkin

hmmm, I've been playing with the PKers lately, and even with with 1 spaced ICS

A really bad idea actually.

They're the best popboomers.

Actually, they're really good at ICS, also. Due to their TALENT, 4 bonus, none of their size 1 bases can riot for anything short of pacifism, and tight base spacing overcomes their low efficiency. They can still pop boom with Demo/Planned/creche just like most factions, when they're ready.

[dacole]

[QUOTE] Originally posted by Lazerus
I think it's almost forced upon any player who wants to compete to use the upgrade trick, most good players i've seen use it.


Hope you are not doing it in the game we are playing...(this has been disallowed in almost every game I've ever played.)

[Lazerus]

lol no i'm always broke, as has been said above anyways, its more effective for high industry factions to make plenty of cheap crawlers. It's the Uni and morgan players who do this predominantly

ps, its a house rule really, pure builders like it allowed and from what i can see it's normally on for the CGN tourney games that i based my observation on.

[dacole]

really? Interesting I've never used it myself in single player or mp games ah well..

[dmm1285]

I was playing with the university a few weeks ago and got one fairly easily around 2125, but I popped a few AA. Also, when I made this post, I forgot about the pod that gives you an instant build.

[Commy]

Since I can pretty much guarentee getting the early SPs before the AI, I generally don't use AAs early in the game, but save them for later SPs...if I get 3 AAs early in the game, I'll use one for the SP I'm building now, then use another one for the next SP and so on...this makes it easier to hurry an SP....

[Ghidorah]

A related question:
How early do you START your first SP? I always seem to struggle with balancing it. You're not going to be able to instabuild that early unless you've got lots of AAs, and having a base tied up with SP building early on is going to have a serious cost in terms of speed of expansion. Even more if you build-and-disband units from other bases. And if you're in Market, you can only have one worker's worth of minerals on it anyway, so you've got wasted population that could have been sent off in a pod.

[Commy]

Well, if I'm on Map of Planet (in which case I have the terrain memorized and know where resources are) usually I will start around 2015-2020...I don't ever hurry my first SPs though, and usually don't use AAs, as there is no competition fromt the AI...

I also usually build a rec tanks and a rec commons (and a former) before starting an SP, especially if I'm on a random map...