Vote for SMAC2 at firaxis.com

[Illuminatus]

Originally posted by Petek
I think this thread may now be "detopped".

As long as the poll is up and SMAC2 is not announced, it'll stay up.

[Zoid]

[Darsnan]

Originally posted by Illuminatus


As long as the poll is up and SMAC2 is not announced, it'll stay up.

This is Illuminatus' way of saying "I've forgotten how to de-top threads and am too embarassed to ask anyone else for help".

[GeoModder]

Long time you made a sneaky post, Darsnan.

[Illuminatus]

Well, everything is good as long as my forgetfulness keeps you voting.

[Net Warrior]

topless?

[Nugog]

I voted for SMAC2 - never played SMAC though.......

[Illuminatus]

Originally posted by Net Warrior
topless?

Please, this is a family site.

Nugog

If they could only aquire the rights to the game back....

[Nugog]

Originally posted by Illuminatus

Nugog

I'd really like to one day, however with work & family I rarely get much time to play CIV, so maybe when the kids leave home, or I retire........

[vyeh]

I voted today for Alpha Centauri. If Firaxis does remake SMAC/X, I hope they clean up the bugs identified on Apolyton, CGN and CivFanatics. I'd like to see the CivIV unit promotion schema. Current results are:

1. Which Sid Meier’s game/series (past or present) would you most like to see remade?
Percent Answer
44% Sid Meier’s Alpha Centauri
1% Sid Meier’s Sim Golf
1% Sid Meier’s Gettysburg!
30% Sid Meier’s Colonization
1% Sid Meier’s Covert Action
3% Sid Meier’s Railroad Tycoon
1% Gunship
0% F-19 Stealth Fighter
1% Red Storm Rising
11% Silent Service
8% I don’t care about remakes, give me something new!


2. What is your gaming platform of choice (aside from the PC)?
Percent Answer
27% Xbox
29% PS2
18% 'Cube
27% Handheld or Mobile


3. Do you frequently play games on a laptop as well as a desktop PC?
Percent Answer
45% Yes
55% No


4. Graphics or Gameplay?
Percent Answer
2% It’s gotta be pretty
51% Balance is the key
47% Who cares about graphics?

[Verrucosus]

There are lots of things I adore in Civ4 and in many ways it is a better game than SMAC, but - in my opinion - the promotion system is not one of them.

Maybe I have not yet learned to use it properly, but there does not seem to be as much strategy to it as to the SMAC system with its design workshop and the tech-dependent special abilities. Building specialised forces in Civ4 is a matter of seizing opportunities rather than making and executing a plan. I suppose it would be possible to formulate a strategic goal to create an army of a certain composition with respect to promotions (e. g. one command unit, 6 units with city raider ability, 2 medics etc.) and seek battles that allow you to get there. If you are lucky and/or persistent enough, you might even get there before the war is over. The idea reminds me uncomfortably of those Civ3 wars drawn out only because I wanted to get two leaders to create my first army and rush the Forbidden Palace. I've not seen any detailed posts about playing Civ4 that way and I don't imagine it to be much fun. The promotion system is an interesting model, but I don't think it's superior to SMAC's.

The challenge with SMAC's system is that you really have to balance all the unit components very carefully and place sensible restrictions so that despite the liberty enjoys when designing his own units the player cannot build really overpowered units (or can do so only at prohibitive cost). Firaxis has always been rather good at this. Although a number of mods show that there was room for improvement, the balancing wasn't all that bad in the original SMAC. Even airpower had its counters, the computer just was just too slow to use them. Teaching the computer how to use a more open system of units seems to be the real problem. If there's an answer to it, I would argue for retaining the workshop. From my perspective as a player, it was far more enjoyable than the promotion system.

[vyeh]

I like the workshop. I'm not suggesting that it be replaced.

I have a Mac, so I have not played Civ IV. What I like about the promotion tree is the idea that units can become specialized through experience.

There was the beginning of this idea in SMAC with elite units getting an extra movement point.

While the extra movement point is useful for attacking infantry, it is less useful for garrisons (although it can help in moving in reinforcements). It would be interesting if there was an option for a garrison unit going from commando to elite to get an extra 25% for defense.

What do you like about Civ IV? In particular, in what way is it a better game than SMAC?

[Nugog]

Any idea when this poll closes?

Or if they will listen to it?

A new and improved SMAC sounds very cool!

[Verrucosus]

No idea about the poll. Given that they are publishing a remake of Railroad Tycoon, it doesn't seem to be too important for them - which is just as it should be. I'm quite certain that there will be a remake because the concept is just too good to pass on, but I'm not in a hurry to see it. The classic SMAC is still there to be enjoyed and I don't have enough time for new games anyway. Maybe they'll time it to coincide with nugog's retirement!

I'm sorry I misread your statement about the promotion system, vyeh. I hadn't looked at it that way, but you are quite correct that the elite movement bonus in SMAC (as well as the 12.5 strength bonus that comes with each experience level) is a basic version of that idea. The Civ4 promotion system is just more complex and combining it with a workshop that includes special abilities might be a bit of overkill.

I don't want to answer your question about Civ4 in too much detail (because there is a slight danger of turning this into a SMAC-Civ4 comparison thread), but the most important point is that it is extremely well balanced and versatile.
- It's been eight months since the game was released and there is still no convincing claim about any feature being as overpowered as aircraft or crawlers were in SMAC. Early forest chopping was very strong before the latest patch, but even that strategy had its opportunity costs (no early religion, delay in cottages).
- It's not an exception to see late-game techs actually used.
- The concept of city maintenance works reasonably well to balance horizontal expansion.
- The resource system (connecting resources that allow you to build certain improvements and that can be traded with other empires) adds a strategic dimension that is absent from SMAC.
- There are thoughful tweaks that avoid mechanical micromanagement (carryover rules, additional movement point for formers) and gameplay bugs have been fewer and less annoying than those in SMAC.
As a result of those and a few minor aspects, I have reluctantly come to the conclusion that - as far as gameplay is concerned - we have finally seen a better game than SMAC. I hasten to add that with regard to game atmosphere, I still consider Alpha Centauri to be the king of the hill.

[gwillybj]

It's Still Up and SMAC2 is Still Number One

1. Which Sid Meier’s game/series (past or present) would you most like to see remade? (Top 3 of 11 are 85% of total.)
45% Sid Meier’s Alpha Centauri
29% Sid Meier’s Colonization
11% Silent Service

2. What is your gaming platform of choice (aside from the PC)?
27% Xbox
29% PS2
18% 'Cube
27% Handheld or Mobile

3. Do you frequently play games on a laptop as well as a desktop PC?
45% Yes
55% No

4. Graphics or Gameplay?
2% It’s gotta be pretty
51% Balance is the key
47% Who cares about graphics?


My purpose in selecting SMAC2 is a simple wish that the bugs in SMAC and SMAX be cleaned out. For me the game is thoroughly enjoyable as it is despite those bugs. I feel no need for a rework.
And is it any surprise that I selected "Who cares about graphics?"