My last big hurdle: Specialist only bases.

[Ka Plewy]

Originally posted by Senethro
My Q: should I have built recreation commons and gone free market/wealth or simply stuck with one worker and a Simple economy until I'd uncovered the tech for specialists and could make really productive bases?

With a Fundy Miriam, I would not choose to prosecute a Vendetta under Wealth, because I wouldn't be able to buy her superior troops, and my troops would probably lose, unless I had 2:1 attack:defense edge. I'd probably go Fundy, Free, Survival, maybe knowledge if her probes are nowhere in sight. Power is never a good choice that early.

Rec commons are a must for Morgan after the first b-drone, b/c you can't afford the mineral support for police.
Also, don't forget, as Morgan, armored probes can be decent defenders in a pinch. I typically expand to first b-drones warnning, get rec-tanks, then expand again, lather, rinse and repeat. If I know I'm alone, I'll forego rec-tanks until 2nd b-drone warrning.

Edit: clarified Vendetta under Wealth w/ Morgan.

[#endgame]

I ususally get Ind Eco first, then FM after that. But then, I'm not the greatest of players, so... it's just my 2e.c.

[binTravkin]

You got WP, that was your mistake. If you got HGP instead you'd have 2 worker bases -> at least 30% more production.

At times of war either build 1 punishment sphere and rehome units to it or switch to Police/Green/Wealth - an awesome approach: gives you police, support, native life and is still +2 econ and +1 industry.

[Ka Plewy]

Originally posted by binTravkin
You got WP, that was your mistake. If you got HGP instead you'd have 2 worker bases -> at least 30% more production.

It's never a mistake to get WP, just a different choice. Maybe not a choice you or I would make, but it is still valid. Before clean comes along, having WP will allow him to field a fewer number of formers, which will conservehis resources. Also, he may not have had a choice about which SP to get. I remember in one game Lal built HGP by 2138, but I imagine he had a lot of luck in popping pods for AAs.

[binTravkin]

2138 is not so good actually, if unless an AI player..

I think it was mistake, because formers are not so crucial at start - just go forest&forget and you need very little formers.
At least HGP would ensure he'd not be "conserving" resources, but outputting lot more.

Normally you should get HGP in early 30s, so noone grabs it before you. Morgan is quite good for b-lining to IA, so there's not so big chance someone else will grab HGP. PTS is completely different case however..
HGP only needs 6 crawlers which are pretty easiy to build (an average base can do it in 4-5 yrs with some hurrying, so 5 yrs after IA you should start HGP and finish in the next turn).

If you were lucky and popped a good instabuild pod/AA, you can build it even earlier.

In Girls Night In game Shawnmcc (best PBEMer I've played against) had built HGP + WP by 2130 (IIRC) by rapid pod popping.

[Ka Plewy]

Originally posted by binTravkin
2138 is not so good actually, if unless an AI player..

Actually, it was an AI, and I laid a bit of a trap for you here. I didn't specifically state that it was AI, and I didn't say what kind of rules I started the game with: Blind-TechStag.

I think it was mistake, because formers are not so crucial at start - just go forest&forget and you need very little formers.
At least HGP would ensure he'd not be "conserving" resources, but outputting lot more.

How many formers depends on whether there's abundant wildlife, clearing fungus is a turn intensive job, and will seriously hamper expansion until more formers are brought to bear. If I'm Morgan, my biggest goal is to eradicate fungus to prevent worms coming at me if I'm going to run an early FM. I know I won't have Trance for quite a while, until after I've built all the SP's I can build.

We don't even know that he had a choice/chance to get WP. Saying it was a mistake without knowing the particulars of the game isn't constructive. He doesn't get an understanding of how to handle his situation he's currently in. I know what I can do when I get the HGP, when I don't, then I have to improvise, or research alternatives, which he's doing. Saying you should've built HGP instead only serves to discount all his choices leading up to this point in the game. My point is forget about the past, you can't fix it, let's look at what we can do now and salvage the future game.

Normally you should get HGP in early 30s, so noone grabs it before you. Morgan is quite good for b-lining to IA, so there's not so big chance someone else will grab HGP. PTS is completely different case however..
HGP only needs 6 crawlers which are pretty easiy to build (an average base can do it in 4-5 yrs with some hurrying, so 5 yrs after IA you should start HGP and finish in the next turn).

Are you lecturing me about beelining to AI? I really don't need the lecture, and would argue that the bulk of readers don't need it unless they specifically ask for it.
FYI, one game, I had a hoard of cash from early pod popping, discovered IA, switched to Wealth, rushed crawlers in all my nearby bases and had HGP in 2 turns. So, what? I only say this to emphasize the fact that we don't know enough about the conditions of this game, and given the information we have, what would we do? I made an assumption (just as you did) that the HGP was NOT available, you assumed it was. Given the choice of building WP or HGP, I would generally build HGP, but, if I'm on a landmass by myself, I might pick WP instead and expand like fungus. IF I was in Senethro's position, and had HGP available and Miriam breathing down my neck, I would build HGP over WP, no doubt.

If you were lucky and popped a good instabuild pod/AA, you can build it even earlier.

Indeed! Luck has a lot to do with it and luck runs a continuum throughout the game from initial placement (hey, I'm in garland crater to start, woo hoo to I'm 5 squares away from Great Dunes, lord help me) to pod popping (I popped 20 AAs this game or I popped 20 pods with more than one worm, 15 of which were 8 worm swarms).

In Girls Night In game Shawnmcc (best PBEMer I've played against) had built HGP + WP by 2130 (IIRC) by rapid pod popping.

Good for him. Again, this is a fair amount of luck, and what would've happened in that game if pods had been disabled?
Luck is something I hope for, but never count on.

Bottom line, we both made some assumptions. However, I attempted to provide advice on what Senethro should do know based on where he's at, while you provided advice on fixing the past, doing it over. I'm sure, that given the chance, he'd do things differently (as you suggested), but that's hindsight, and everyone has 20/20 hindsight.