Why does nerve gas cause ecological damage?

[Enigma_Nova]

Yeah, what he said.
I guess I'll take your word for it, and say CASE CLOSED on the nervegas issue.
Play balance... that has to be it, play balance.

[Dis]

now I think of it, I think there was some popup regarding my gas use.

I think once you pass a certain point, very bad things start to happen. I may try this again and pay closer attention to my bases and popups. I'd like to see how much I can get away with.

[Enigma_Nova]

If you have enough clean superformers, some SAM Artie and empath rovers, you can get away with ANYTHING.

[Blake]

... unless it's a scenerio where raise/lower land is disabled. heh.

I'm trying to determine how the gas works, playing as pyscotic Data Angels and gassing everyone off the face of planet.

Heres how it seems to work:
You gas up to a bit over 1000 turns of sanctions, not one pf these attacks causes ED.
Then ALL the factions declare Vendetta on you.
At this point, Planet decides to start taking it personally also, each gas attack now reduces clean minerals by 1.

So please yourself if you decide it's game balance, or Planet empathicly picking up the overwhelming hate for your faction.

edit: Err nope, seems to be a MAJOR atrocity with every gassing, meaning -5 Clean Minerals, my Angels are going to be harvesting planetpearls for eons....

[Enigma_Nova]

1000 sanctions would get completed in 14 gassings.
That's not a lot of gas to play with. :/

[Blake]

Why stop gassing? I'm continuing my Angels game, and gassed the drones some more, prehaps racking up somewhere around -40 clean minerals. Every turn I harvest worms for mad cash, then my probe teams sweep around the borders probing all the enemy faction units, then I rushbuy stuff, and I STILL have enough energy for a retirement fund.

Altough I can't exactly attack the other factions because my bases are still flat out building empath rovers, trance-synth-noodles, various infrastructure like creches (I'm running fundie/green/wealth) and formers to raise land... if the sea level rises stacked properly they would be at around 4000m. I already lost the PTS to sea level rises (if I was paying attention I woulda rushed a dome).

This is one pissed planet. I reckon Dee and Dawn have been whispering in planets ear, telling planet how evil the Angels are.

[Blake]

Okay, this is weird. I continued playing for a while, then suddenly all the ED was gone. GONE! I know there was still a good 30 or so ED in some bases the turn before. The same turn, the other AI's started talking to me and offering truces and whats not, so apparentely the ED from Gassing (and prehaps atrocities) expires after a while.

Fortunately, gassing Domai a few more times bought the ED back, so I could continue harvesting planet for fun and profit.

[smacksim]

So it expires some years after you start gassing, even if you are gassing during the interim? That is Weird.

-S

[Chaunk]

Do you have saves of that blake? I'd love to look at that in more detail... Perhaps you rolled over the atrocities count?

[Enigma_Nova]

Rolled over the attrocities count...
...
...

So if you kill enough stuff you become noble again.

[Blake]

Theres no kind of rollovers... altough it does seem something odd is happening to the atrocity count.
Every pre-outrage gassing causes +1 Minor Atrocity
Then post-outrage every gassing causes +1 Minor and +1 Major Atrocities

But then the Minor atrocities seem to cap at 20 for a while, while Major atrocities keep increasing.

But then Minor atrocities start increasing again....

I'm not quite sure whats going on there, altough it does seem major atrocities seems to correctely count the number of gassings post-outrage.

From looking through my saves, it seems the ED for the gassings expires after 10 turns.

Anyway, I've included one save just before the other factions are outraged - just gas two things. The second save is 10 turns later.

[Enigma_Nova]

So the Sanctions are in place for 1000 turns, but the ED only stays in there for 10.
Great... so if you're fortified for a 10 year planetsiege, you can gas everyone into oblivion.
Marvellous.

[Blake]

Hmmm I think it's actually more balanced with the 10 turn ED, in the 10 turn ED siege I made somewhere around 3000 credits. Thats some pretty serious income for that early in the game.

[Blake]

Yay with the discovery of MMI and the addition of XChoppers I can finally get some more income, nothing like 500 credits a turn from worms.

It might be that killing a unit with gas gives -1 clean minerals, and attacking a base gives -5.

Check this out, I captured a fungal tower .

[Enigma_Nova]

NW.
Disband it, since it will only revert back next turn.