NFL - Are You Ready For Some Football?! - 08/09 Season

[Supr49er]

Yeah, you're right.

We were just spoiled for so long.

[Lord Avalon]

The Dolphins had some winning seasons post-Marino, but fell short of the playoffs. Been downhill ever since. I think Chad Pennington is an upgrade, but I'm hoping he'll just hold down the fort until Chad Henne is ready, and I hope he'll actually be good.

Miami QBs: Trent Green , Cleo Lemon, Daunte Culpepper (knee wasn't 100%, showed what bad judgment he had as a pocket passer), Joey Harrington, Gus Frerotte, AJ Feeley (traded a 2nd rd pick for him ), Brian Griese, Jay Fiedler, Ray Lucas.

Fiedler wasn't too bad, but not good enough to get the Dolphins over that playoff hump, and IIRC, not too durable.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Supr49er
I am a lifelong 49ers fan going back to the early 1960s.

After John Brodie, Joe Montana, Steve Young, and even Jeff Garcia, I couldn't relate until now. Alex Smith? J. T. O'Sullivan?

You mean the J.T. O'Sullivan who has a passer rating of 96.3?! Now it was against Arizona (whose defensive is underrated mind) and Seattle, but come on... he's not that bad compared to the likes of Kyle Orton, Chad Pennington, Rex Grossman, John Kitna, etc.

[Supr49er]

Maybe He'll be OK. I wonder why he's played for so many NFL teams and NFL Europe.

But Mike Martz found and developed Kurt Warner, so who knows?

I went to two pre-season games and several practices and he didn't look all that good.

[Lord Avalon]

It'd be kinda funny if O'Sullivan does well this year, as he used to be a Lion backup.

[Supr49er]

Yeah, and Detroit plays at San Francisco this Sunday.

[Jaguar]

Let's discuss the fact that Mike Martz got J.T. O'Sullivan to throw for 320 yards and no interceptions against a talented defense.

It amazes me how much people try to denigrate him because he challenges the "establish the run" conventional wisdom and generally just does his own thing. Because he put together the best offensive run ever that didn't include Peyton Manning, and was rightly praised for it, people have absurd expectations for him wherever he goes, and subject him to massive amounts of criticism while duds like Eric Mangini and Brad Childress go unscathed.

Much is made of how he failed as a head coach, and it's really not true. He made the playoffs four out of six years with two different quarterbacks, neither of whom have looked particularly good without him. He made the Superbowl in one of those years. Many teams would love to be able to have that kind of success, but apparently that only qualified him to be Offensive Coordinator for the Lions, where he made stars out of Jon Kitna and Mike Furrey. Now that he's gone, Detroit has collapsed, despite the emergence of Calvin Johnson.

Now he's in San Francisco, again relegated to Offensive Coordinator, and he's getting legitimate, even good NFL QB production out of J.T. O'Sullivan. Can we finally put the argument that "he just looked good because he had Orlando Pace and Torry Holt" to rest?

[Supr49er]

Having played against the Rams twice a year, I always feared "The Greatest Show on Turf". I had respect for Martz, and am excited to see him help the moribund 49er offense.

[ramseya]

Mike Martz is an offensive genius.

The 49ers schedule is pretty tough (with playing the AFC East), so I don't think they'll do better than 7-9, but they'll put up a hell a lot of yardage and the defense is going to be great this year (showed a little bit against Seattle in Week 2).

Imran:

Kitna and Pennington don't belong on your list. Pennington is the NFL all-time leader in career completion %. I know he can't throw more than 20 yards but it's still an accomplishment.

and Kitna is hardly a good QB but he's pretty solid and can really air it out. His career stats are solid; two 4000 yard passing seasons, in 2003 he threw 26 TDs... He's definitely a notch above Grossman, et al.

[SlowwHand]

Passing is great, Jaguar; but if you can't run, ultimately you're screwed.

[ramseya]

Marshall Faulk?

[SlowwHand]

What was the question that you're answering? Is this Jeopardy?

[Lord Avalon]

I'd hardly call Kitna solid - unless it's followed by "backup". He's only thrown 1 more TD than INT. 26 TDs in 2003? Looks like that's when he peaked. I'm not impressed by 4K yd seasons - those were a product of Martz's pass-happy system. He makes poor decisions. As the latest example, he led the Lions to a 25-24 lead on the Packers, then threw three INTs (including 2 pick sixes) to kill any chance of winning.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Pennington is the NFL all-time leader in career completion %. I know he can't throw more than 20 yards but it's still an accomplishment.

He used to be... before all those arm surgerys. Now he's a shell of himself.

and Kitna is hardly a good QB but he's pretty solid and can really air it out. His career stats are solid; two 4000 yard passing seasons, in 2003 he threw 26 TDs... He's definitely a notch above Grossman, et al.

Most QBs are a notch above Grossman. However, Kitna has a career QB rating of 76.8 and 6.7 yards per attempt. He has ONE more TD than Int in his career.

[Ming]

I would have to agree on Kitna. Thanks to Martz, he racked up some yardage and TDs. But he does make poor decisions, can't really survive under preasure in the pocket, and does throw WAY too may interceptions to be considered great. He's just your average QB who will show some flashess some days, and look awful on others.