Rugby - Laissez la balle, Bleus!

[finbar]

Former England skipper John Emburey says county cricket should consider a bar on emerging Australian players for the good of the national side.

Most of the current Australian Test team have played county cricket, as have many on the fringes of the team.

"The counties developed a lot of these Australians. They honed their skills here and went back better players.

"Perhaps we should say we don't want to develop them into top-quality players," Emburey told BBC Sport.

"We set Mike Hussey on the way and helped Matthew Hayden and Justin Langer at the back end of the 1990s.

"Perhaps we should see how the Australians fare just by playing domestic cricket and having 10 championship matches a year".

I don't think he was joking. Dolt.

[Havak]

He is a nobody so don't worry about that nonsense.

Croke park is certainly impressive.

[ravagon]

Originally posted by Havak

Well that should have Ravagon choking on his morning coffee nicely.

Didn't get to read all of this until after lunch but the principle's the same I'll grant you.
When I suggested earlier that the SH competition was superior I was actually talking about the S14 in comparison to the HC (being the analagous NH equivalent), not the 6N.
In comparing national 6N teams with club S14 teams even the lower-ranked NH teams (the identities of which I will leave to your imagination ) should be able to put in a credible performance.

I do think though that if you took, say the top 6 teams from both the S14 and the HC, and put them into the other competition, the S14 teams would fare considerably better on average.

[ravagon]

Oh and, erm ... The cricket.

[finbar]

Originally posted by ravagon

being the analagous NH equivalent

Perth is too small for you.

[Havak]

I honestly think you would be surprised there Ravagon. Surpised I disagree?

I can see Crusaders, Blues and Brumbies challenging for the elimination phases of the HC but I don't see them as being more competitive than the European Titans like Toulouse, Leicester, Munster and even (god help us) Wasps.

And my reasoning here is not down to the quality of the players - I'm not criticising S14 on that basis here. In the HC to get out of a pool you have to play every other side in that pool both home and away - alien to S14 franchises.

I would honestly question whether sides like Crusaders have ever experienced the atmosphere of visiting grounds like Toulouse or Munster - think friendly intimidation on a massive scale. I suspect Kiwi crowds can be like that amongst themselves but otherwise it is all the antiseptic Aussie crowds (I swear they simply don't 'get' rugby for the most part) or the overt hostility of Bok crowds (nasty enough - but not quite the same).

It's honestly very hard to explain unless you have experienced it.

The top four qualifiers get a home QF. The SF is played as a neutral ground in the country of the top seed involved in each. The final is played at a pre-determined national stadium - Tigers winning the cup in Paris and Cardiff for example. The whole set up is very alien to S14 franchises who are used to the rotating fixtures and nice safe home play off matches.

Then of course it would depend on whether HC clubs played S14 or S14 franchises came north to play HC. S14 clubs heading north would be playing far more rugby and their squads being tested to a much higher degree. I think even mighty Crusaders have less players on the books than the European clubs I have already mentioned and a European schedule will deplete squads far more than a quick S14 season.

For that last reason I doubt many S14 franchises would be challenging for the Premiership or the French league at the end of a season. Their quality might well see them get further in the cups - but the league program is punishing in a way I think SH fans would struggle to understand (24 games to win the Premiership with 9 internationals played within that program too).

European sides are international sides too - those S14 franchises would come up against clubs fielding their countrymen - and in many cases the guys they face will be better than the ones the S14 franchises were forced to select due to S14s closed shop in NZ and Australia.

There's always the weather too - games played in rain and mud. The kiwi franchises might eat that up - but my word do Aussies whine about it (every Wallaby tour they moan about the lack of firm surfaces and roofs not being closed - wusses!).

Just some food for thought for you - but I honestly believe Tigers would transplant better into S14 than Crusaders or Blues could make the reverse switch.

I know you like to tease me that S14 doesn't field NH players because the incumbents are better but the counter argument to that is that when the S12 gates were open the only UK players that went were Kevin Yates and Gregor Townsend - hardly A list.

Then we could look at who comes north if you like - Tigers alone have taken Kronfeld, Gibson and Mauger. So keep producing those good players - we do like to take em.

[finbar]

I didn't do a word count, but it's obviously a quiet day in the office.

[Caligastia]

I think it's hard to say if putting S14 teams in the HC or vice-versa would yield better results for the NH or SH teams. Quite possibly, the HC schedule would be too gruelling for the SH teams, but I don't think a situation such as that would be a fair test of team merit anyway. You'd have to have something like a 5-match series on neutral ground between the winners of each competition. In that situation, of course, the SH team would come out of top.

[MikeH]

Is anyone going to the World Cup?

I'm going to Scotland Romania, Scotland New Zealand and the Quarter Final in Cardiff. Probably NZ vs Ireland or NZ vs France.

/showing off.

[Havak]

Seeing NZ win once and lose twice - lucky you.

It was a quiet early morning Finbar - sadly the day then failed to conform to that requested format. But thanks for proving once more that 'less' in indeed 'more'.

Oh and I'd back Tigers to beat any SH club side in a best of five Cal. All played at Welford Road of course.

[MikeH]

I will be supporting Romania and New Zealand vs Scotland (should make my Scottish gf happy). And Ireland if they get through or the Kiwis if they are playing France. Couldn't bear the Frogs being World Champions.

[finbar]

I'll be supporting Italy. For my sins. EDIT. Though having just checked out Pool C, they can get past the pool stage.

I think even mighty Crusaders have less players on the books than the European clubs I have already mentioned and a European schedule will deplete squads far more than a quick S14 season.

The maximum player roster for S14 is 30. The whole set up is designed for an entirely different competition - in terms of demands - so it's a fairly pointless debate. But since when has that stopped us before?

I will be supporting Romania and New Zealand vs Scotland

There are two wins for you.

[Havak]

To answer your question (rhetorical though it was).

Never.

[finbar]

And it gives ravagon something to do to pass the time in Perth. Watching paint dry never caught on over there. Too stimulating.

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by Havak

Oh and I'd back Tigers to beat any SH club side in a best of five Cal. All played at Welford Road of course.

Sounds fair.