Farewell (an "I'm Leaving Forever" thread)

[MOBIUS]

You might have an inkling that it exactly this sort of message that has a lot of established posters looking for the doors, or maybe you don't.

I hope the new admins do.

He's already made his choice - I'm merely reminding him that it is a morally repugnant choice and that, as far as I'm concerned, he's burned his bridges.

These people seem to think that a terrible crime is excusable if the person it was perpetrated against was someone they didn't like.

I'm only bringing this up because one of their posters brought it up when he posted "Heil Dale", but it reminds me of all the professional classes in Germany doing nothing about the Nazi excesses against the Jews in the run up to WWII because: a) they weren't the victims; and b) hey, at least the trains ran on time...

[rah]

You might have an inkling that it exactly this sort of message that has a lot of established posters looking for the doors, or maybe you don't.

I hope the new admins do.

Notyoueither, do you think what Dale did was acceptable? If not, what type of punishment do you think was deserved?

[Cort Haus]

Executive Summary

WPC?

We Play Civ - a schism site set up by Dale, Locutus and Solver following staff splits at poly about the position and direction of the site. Their line is that poly has too much technical and personal baggage to be able to revitalise the on-topic areas, and that a clean slate is needed. The opposition line is that the new site is to permit a vehicle for Dale after his abuse of powers, probable breaking of Data Protection laws (I only know them in my own country) and death-threat.

A People's Front of Judea / Judean People's Front situation has arisen, with supporters of the new project now posting on WPC, and a faction of 'loyalists' (some might see them as the UTA (United Troll Alliance)) setting up camp on Counterglow.

Cybershy (now Robert Plomp aka Cyberplomp) now owns poly with some other guy I'd never heard of, and JM and Lorizael are now OTF mods.

Some of the departees to WPC are doubtless genuinely seeking an on-topic alternative to CFC, and others seem somewhat sympathetic to the WPC leadership. As this includes Dale, controversy rages, with opponents accusing all posters at WPC of condoning death-threats. (Mobius has been leading this campaign against what Che calls the 'Confederates'.) Clearly though, some who are posting on WPC disagree with that analysis and are still posting here (and Counterglow).

My £0.02 is that active civvers on Poly should do what we can to try and rekindle the embers of on-topic civ discussion. I even made a post on the Civ 4 forum today.

[DrSpike]

My £0.02 is that some people seem to want to play up all the drama. For most balanced posters it is not a choice between posting here, at WPC, or CFC - it's perfectly reasonable to seek different things from different forums. Posting at WPC does not mean you condone death threats - that's just absurd.

At the moment this is still the most fun site, and CFC is the best for Civ. WPC has potential in both areas, and if through hard work they realise that I'll post there more. Equally, the new ownership here has stated they want to rejuvenate on topic.

[Asher]

My £0.02 is that some people seem to want to play up all the drama. For most balanced posters it is not a choice between posting here, at WPC, or CFC - it's perfectly reasonable to seek different things from different forums. Posting at WPC does not mean you condone death threats - that's just absurd.

The admin at WPC are demonstrably incompetent.

Dale -- fresh off of his abuse of power in deletion of posts, researching of personal information with his admin privledges, and issuing of a death threat...he is now posting screenshots of PMs sent to him from Poly on his new site.

Shame on anyone for giving his site any kind of visit. If you do visit the site -- a site which essentially gave him a promotion for breaking several laws and being way out of line -- it does put into question your morals.

[Q Classic]

This schism is about as acrimonious as the Orthodox/Catholic one back in 1054.

[rah]

And to top it off. He posted private PMs on the other site. He posted his private apology to Asher, which you have to question why he feels the need to do it privately but refuses in public. Then he posts Ashers reply in hopes of trivalizing the matter. He sunk even lower with this. And people still defend his actions. It's the worst case of blinders I've ever seen.

And no Asher, this doesn't mean I'm defending your actions.

[Asher]

And to top it off. He posted private PMs on the other site. He posted his private apology to Asher, which you have to question why he feels the need to do it privately but refuses in public. Then he posts Ashers reply in hopes of trivalizing the matter. He sunk even lower with this. And people still defend his actions. It's the worst case of blinders I've ever seen.

And no Asher, this doesn't mean I'm defending your actions.

I have to think it's a matter of stubbornness. People have hitched their car to various trains, and for a lot of people it's hard -- if not impossible -- to side with me even though Dale's actions are clearly inexcusable and unacceptable and systematic. So now they stubbornly defend Dale against all reason, because they feel they have no other choice.

[notyoueither]

Notyoueither, do you think what Dale did was acceptable?

Not at all.

If not, what type of punishment do you think was deserved?

Banning. For a good, long time.

The point of what you replied to was not Dale. It is the sorts of expression that are allowed on these forums that have much of the staff and many long time posters heading for the doors.

It isn't a black and white situation. I think there's plenty of dirt on 'both sides.'

[duke o' york]

I've posted there, and will probably do so again. Dale has nothing to do with it, and I don't feel as though I am condoning his shocking response to your spat. I'm keen to see 'poly succeed, and will do all I can to help it, although my skills are probably useless to a site looking to reinvent itself. Asher, you on the other hand, have skills that can help this site improve itself, and grow larger, and I'm amazed the powers that be haven't at least asked for your advice, if not already given you the power to do something about it.

[notyoueither]

He's already made his choice - I'm merely reminding him that it is a morally repugnant choice and that, as far as I'm concerned, he's burned his bridges.

These people seem to think that a terrible crime is excusable if the person it was perpetrated against was someone they didn't like.

I'm only bringing this up because one of their posters brought it up when he posted "Heil Dale", but it reminds me of all the professional classes in Germany doing nothing about the Nazi excesses against the Jews in the run up to WWII because: a) they weren't the victims; and b) hey, at least the trains ran on time...

Hyperbole much?

Perhaps you can answer this, if it was such a terrible crime, then why has the victim not reported it to the authorities?

[Asher]

Hyperbole much?

Perhaps you can answer this, if it was such a terrible crime, then why has the victim not reported it to the authorities?

I think I will, actually, since this is being used as an argument to make it seem like it was okay.

It'll end this matter pretty abruptly.

Dale has gratefully assisted in providing his full name and address by registering his new site as well.

Are these guys the right ones to go to? http://www.afp.gov.au/home.html

[Velociryx]

and away we go...

-=Vel=-

[DrSpike]

For certain Dale deserves the negative reaction he has had from many posters. But the bit of the argument amongst those trying to play up drama for fun (and let's be honest it is for **** and giggles, with a bit of point-scoring thrown in, rather than out of serious concern) that falls down is that posting at his site means you condone his actions.

Mods/posters/admins here have done/said plenty of things over 8 years of posting that I disagree with. I don't think that by continuing to post here I condone any of those things.

Post where you want I say.

[Asher]

and away we go...

-=Vel=-

You sure are taking a long time to leave, Vel.

Apparently this thread was just another one of your LOOK AT ME threads.