Gunman kills at least 20, injures 42 in Florida gay club shooting.

[Kidlicious]

according to my first link those 3 are in the top 25 in gun deaths along with most other red states

the red states have higher homicide rates and more guns with fewer controls, the blue left wing states have a better record

No they don't. The two stats are different. You are trying to hack.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Proves what point?

That you have no ****ing clue about operating in a close combat situation where you're under fire and some ******* stitches you from your ******* to your cranium (in your case, a single round would do the trick) while you play out "this is my rifle, this is my gun" in your attempt to be the hero that would save the day. I know you like to play word games and be a disingenous little ****, but this is all in reference to your bull**** about how if everyone was packing everywhere, all the time, life would be ****ing kum-ba-ya.

That you mock "defenseless birds" tells me pretty much everything I needed to know about you being a city slicker.

I'm not sure on what planet using the words "defenseless animals" has anything to do with "mocking" defenseless birds, but if you think duck blasting ducks with a shotgun gives you the slightest clue about handling a shooter in a MOUT setting, then you're even more stupid than you sound. Maybe you wouldn't be the sniveling ***** under the table. Maybe you'd be Cowboy Bob and hose a couple of bystanders before the real shooter put you out of your misery. The fact remains, you're an ignorant ****up with an ignorantly over-inflated sense of capability, and people like you in any type of real shooting situation would be a colossal ****up.

How many of your targets ever had the theoretical ability to shoot back? or shot first? I'm sure you have some great stories about how you finally got Daffy Duck. Maybe we can call you Elmer Fudd now, although I hesitate to insult a cartoon character.

[Berzerker]

No they don't. The two stats are different. You are trying to hack.

one link shows death by gun and the other shows homicides, the red states have more of both

and homicide rates weren't higher back in the late 80s and early 90s because of crack, they were higher because Reagan's drug war increased penalties for adults convicted of dealing. That led to the mass recruitment of minors into the drug trade and juvenile crime rates ballooned

[Kidlicious]

one link shows death by gun and the other shows homicides, the red states have more of both

and homicide rates weren't higher back in the late 80s and early 90s because of crack, they were higher because Reagan's drug war increased penalties for adults convicted of dealing. That led to the mass recruitment of minors into the drug trade and juvenile crime rates ballooned

We are talking about homicides. That's called hacking.

Drug use causes homicide. Crackheads did the murdering. Reagan did a lot to stop the prevalence of drug use and murder.

[Proteus_MST]

Proves what point? That I've been a hunter for a long time and that I'm reasonably familiar with a shotgun? That you mock "defenseless birds" tells me pretty much everything I needed to know about you being a city slicker.

Hunter ... what does this entail?
(In germany for example you have to get a hunting license first, which includes practical exams in shooting, aniumal dissection, but also theoretical exams in animal anatomy (in order to know where to hit them in order to immediately die instead of slowly bleed to death) and animal behavior, weapons expertise and many more ... with other words, in germany you cannot just grab a weapon, shoot animals and then call yourself "hunter")

[Elok]

Getting back to topic, this Mateen nutjob appears to have been a regular patron of the club, as well as (surprise!) showing a long previous history of mental instability.

[onodera]

Gay + homophobic upbringing and culture = mental issues. Mental issues + access to guns = massacre. The math is simple.

[Elok]

If it actually were that simple, we'd have no gay nightclubs left at this point.

[dannubis]

Or Ben would be performing a cownboy scene in them holding his gun and...

[Lorizael]

If it actually were that simple, we'd have no gay nightclubs left at this point.

I think the math is that simple, with the inclusion of some probabilities.

[Elok]

Really the pertinent variable is ready access to guns; we have no means of preventing people from going bat**** insane and successfully hiding it, and there are basically an infinite number of causes for lunatics to latch onto. We will do nothing to address this problem any more than we addressed previous problems, first because we have the attention span of gerbils--remember last week, when it was all about the Stanford rape case--and second because every massacre gets effortlessly shoehorned into more or less the exact same culture-war narrative. Sandy Hook came closest to achieving something, because a lot of dead kindergartners was shocking enough to keep the conversation going a while. There were a few cases of voluntary gun collections before it all petered out.

This will be, if anything, less effective than usual, because of the gay angle. Now in addition to the existing "guns caused this/more guns would have stopped this" rubbish, we have "conservative Christians caused this/he was ****ing Muslim, don't you try to pin this **** on us" rubbish. You could argue that the true root cause is that, honestly, America is too divided to achieve meaningful progress on much of anything.

[Elok]

I think the math is that simple, with the inclusion of some probabilities.

This is the first gay-targeted mass shooting I can recall. As often as not, the shootings appear to have no particular motive beyond angry + crazy + gun. If about two percent of every population is gay, and about a quarter or a third of the US is religiously conservative (probably a lowball estimate), and of those maybe a quarter are males between fifteen and fifty or so, you wind up with millions of people who should be dangerously unstable. Dubious, to say the least.

[Lorizael]

This is the first gay-targeted mass shooting I can recall.

Mass shooting, maybe, yeah. But violence against gays is pretty darn common.

As often as not, the shootings appear to have no particular motive beyond angry + crazy + gun. If about two percent of every population is gay, and about a quarter or a third of the US is religiously conservative (probably a lowball estimate), and of those maybe a quarter are males between fifteen and fifty or so, you wind up with millions of people who should be dangerously unstable. Dubious, to say the least.

Your made up stats give about half a million people for the US. But that's why I said probability matters. Those conditions are necessary, but not sufficient. It's not that each member of that population has a percent chance of going psycho each year due to inherent instability, but that some percentage of that population will also have a history of abuse, or some recent trauma, as well as maybe some genetic predisposition to violence, and a lack of support structures, etc... all of which add up to a chance that going pscyho happens.

[Bereta_Eder]

The issue is simply the guns.
You can make a psychological profile (his dad, who's running for office or some such in... pakistan) made some funny statements that yeah gays are sinful but well maybe god should punish them not man and such bullcrap etc etc


But no guns, no fuss

[Bereta_Eder]

A turkish newspaper with strong ties to Erdogan and his AKP is very happy about the shooting

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ocial-facebook

That's so sad because of course not all turkey is like that.

There is cumhurriyet a great and brave newspaper.

Unfortunately now closed, taken over and its journalists in jail.