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The 'splosion-nerdstuff continuum

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  • The 'splosion-nerdstuff continuum

    Every time a technically accomplished but plot-disadvantaged action movie comes out (Star Trek reboot, Avatar, SW7), we hear the argument which goes, in essence, "This movie is about splosions and splosions are good and if you expect more than splosions from a movie you write Voldemort/Optimus Prime slash fiction in your mom's basement." Not that I'm biased on the subject or anything.

    Either side of the argument can be taken to obviously wrong extremes. On the one hand, SW7 could be ninety minutes of three-second cuts of things moving fast, shooting lasers and blowing up, with no plot or context even in the very limited sense of which vehicle is causing which other vehicle to explode. And they aren't even Star Wars vehicles. If you would settle for that, you are likely some sort of moron.

    On the other, the movie could have a beautiful, original plot, be well acted and directed with cleverly executed action scenes and sparkling dialogue, but there's some d-bag somewhere on the internet pointing out that Jakku's economy really couldn't work unless one assumes a completely unfeasible price for scrap parts from weather-damaged obsolete starships, or else a collapse of the broader galactic economy which would make large-scale military campaigns problematic, etc.

    But there are positions in between. You could insist on having some kind of plot and characters, but be okay with both being stupid or unoriginal as long as it's free of basic logic errors like characters being two places at once or inexplicably coming back from the dead. Or you could be substantially more demanding and ask that all the characters' actions make logical sense in in-story terms (Why the hell are they trusting Finn? And haven't they learned by now to stop building giant doomsday weapons with catastrophic weakpoints?).

    Where do you stand? No poll since there are basically an infinite number of midpoints on the continuum and it'd take forever to enumerate a representative sample.
    1011 1100
    Pyrebound--a free online serial fantasy novel

  • #2
    Someone needs to mention the "BEWBS" factor.

    ---------------

    I'm pretty easy to please when it comes to movies. If it looks good and has some action, and doesn't try to get too philosophical (without the backing ... philosophical with the backing is fine). For instance, Jupiter Rising. It was a completely absurd plot. It looked amazing at times. Had some fun action. It basically skipped over the morality of space soylent green in favor of Maid in Manhattan in Space. I liked it.

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    • #3
      Story wins every time for me. It's like gameplay vs graphics in games.

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      • #4
        For me it depends on the movie as a whole ...
        I can take a lot of illogical stuff without it harming my movie experience.

        For example I have always accepted the Star Wars sytem of having starships behave like jetfighters, despite knowing how wrong/far from realiuty this is ... didn´t make me less of a Star Wars fan.

        But the ridiculousness that was introduced with Episode I was too much for me to bear ...
        like having C3PO and R2D2 be Anakins Droids (in a huge Galaxy with thousands of worlds in the empire/old republic and surely trillions of droids)

        As for Star Wars VII ... I notice the logical fallacies/inconsistencies (for example, being able to see the Starkillers SUperlaser from planets lightyears away ... or to hyperjump half a galaxy length within just minutes (where in Star Wars IV it took hours if not days to jump from Tatooine to Alderaan) ... but the return of the old cast ... and the return to storytelling principles of Episodes 4-6 easily lets me forget the logical flaws


        (generally speaking however, aside from Star Wars, I love it when SciFi-Movies (or series) are as Hard SciFi as possible, without having to sacrifice the story ... which is why I like movies like "The Martain", or "Gravity" and also see it as positive that the reminagined Battlestar Galactica series tried to pout more realism into the behavior of their spaceship, than it was in the original BSG series)
        Tamsin (Lost Girl): "I am the Harbinger of Death. I arrive on winds of blessed air. Air that you no longer deserve."
        Tamsin (Lost Girl): "He has fallen in battle and I must take him to the Einherjar in Valhalla"

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        • #5
          but the return of the old cast ... and the return to storytelling principles of Episodes 4-6 easily lets me forget the logical flaws
          Agreed, especially since we got the return of the old Banter among them.
          Somehow the banter in 1-3, wasn't enough, wasn't believable, wasn't among likable characters, and backed by awful acting.

          And as proven, the banter doesn't have to be particularly clever to be enjoyable.
          I am always willing to accept less "special effects" if the banter is entertaining.
          It's almost as if all his overconfident, absolutist assertions were spoonfed to him by a trusted website or subreddit. Sheeple
          RIP Tony Bogey & Baron O

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          • #6
            I fall on different points on the continuum depending on the movie. For me, it's about the tone and mood of a movie. Take Interstellar, for example. The feeling of the movie was all about how science is great and and we shouldn't lose the explorer spirit... but the actual plot hinged on (a) scientists doing very unsciencey things and (b) love somehow literally being a force in the universe. Incongruities like that bother me.

            On the other hand, in something like Star Wars, the tone they're going for is half adventure and half magic spirituality. And in that context, I can ignore a whole lot that I might not in other movies because I want to appreciate the movie for what it's trying to be. So I can ignore plot holes like the immediate trust for Finn, because in a world where plucky heroes are taking on evil overlords, discriminating between the two is easy.

            There are some genres I don't enjoy at all, so I have no desire to see them do their thing well. Sports movies (with a couple exceptions) are a good example of that.

            And there is an almost infinite capacity to find plot holes in any movie, such that I think enjoying a movie inevitably involves willing blindness to some plot holes--selective suspension of disbelief. So the question for me is which plot holes am I willing to overlook in which genres.
            Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
            "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Lorizael View Post
              Take Interstellar, for example. The feeling of the movie was all about how science is great and and we shouldn't lose the explorer spirit... but the actual plot hinged on (a) scientists doing very unsciencey things and (b) love somehow literally being a force in the universe. Incongruities like that bother me.
              a) Happens all the time in real life, scientists are three dimensional like everyone else, and
              b) is a FACT, not an incongruity at all.

              Interstellar: manual for life.


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              • #8
                Originally posted by ricketyclik View Post
                a) Happens all the time in real life, scientists are three dimensional like everyone else...
                Certainly. My problem was that in a movie that professes to be about how our drive to explore and be curious and figure stuff out is of paramount importance, the characters should ultimately succeed because of that stuff, even if they don't live up to the ideal initially or consistently.
                Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
                "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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                • #9
                  They figured out that the unifying theory of everything is love

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                  • #10
                    That's fantastic. And how does love unify general relativity and quantum field theory? Is gravity quantized? Is everything made of (heart)strings?
                    Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
                    "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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                    • #11
                      See Interstellar for the explanation. I'm not much good at wrapping my mind around those things.

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                      • #12
                        I did.
                        Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
                        "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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                        • #13
                          Oh good, so you already know.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Lorizael View Post
                            That's fantastic. And how does love unify general relativity and quantum field theory? Is gravity quantized? Is everything made of (heart)strings?
                            The basic fabric of the universe is composed of cosmic spluge.

                            We are all star-spunk.


                            Last edited by Thoth; January 25, 2016, 15:07.
                            Libraries are state sanctioned, so they're technically engaged in privateering. - Felch
                            I thought we're trying to have a serious discussion? It says serious in the thread title!- Al. B. Sure

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Lorizael View Post
                              I fall on different points on the continuum depending on the movie. For me, it's about the tone and mood of a movie. Take Interstellar, for example. The feeling of the movie was all about how science is great and and we shouldn't lose the explorer spirit... but the actual plot hinged on (a) scientists doing very unsciencey things and (b) love somehow literally being a force in the universe. Incongruities like that bother me.
                              ...
                              For me a letdown in Interstellar (aside from b) was,
                              that, despite lots of hard SciFi elements, some things didn´t make sense ...
                              for example the time dilation around the water planet:
                              Even if you simplify it, the ship in orbit around the planet would be half the time be nearer to the black hole (than the planet) and half the time be farther away ... meaning that the difference in times (between ship and landing crew) would more or less cancel themselves out (meaning that the time difference between up there and down there shouldn´t be all too big)
                              Tamsin (Lost Girl): "I am the Harbinger of Death. I arrive on winds of blessed air. Air that you no longer deserve."
                              Tamsin (Lost Girl): "He has fallen in battle and I must take him to the Einherjar in Valhalla"

                              Comment

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