Soviet police killed the wrong Chechnyan yet again?

[Hauldren Collider]

It's like the cold war never ended.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_are_lynching_Negroes

[Ellestar]

Given that dead afroamericans are a laughing matter for US citizens, it shouldn't be that hard to understand that Russian citizens just don't care about gays (given that they aren't even brutally murdered, like afroamericans in USA).

[Hauldren Collider]

There's nothing funny about dead black people. There is everything funny about a sad Russian such as yourself trying to justify the ****hole of a country you live in by referencing America's comparatively paltry social woes.

The fact that you are so far down the rabbit hole you have lost any ability to detect irony is the funniest aspect of all.

[Ellestar]

There's nothing funny about dead black people. There is everything funny about a sad Russian such as yourself trying to justify the ****hole of a country you live in by referencing America's comparatively paltry social woes.

Yeah, of course, dead black people in USA are black, gays in Russia are white. So dead blacks in your own country are less important for US citizens than alive whites in a country on the other side of the Earth, i see.

[YoYoYoHeyyy]

This is reminiscent of the Tienanmen Square threads back when we still had Chinese posters / sympathizers to troll

American poster: The Tienanmen Square massacre was a bad thing
Chinese poster / sympathizer: Oh yeah? Well, America isn't perfect!
American poster: Agreed
Chinese poster / sympathizer: Therefore China can do whatever it wants until America is perfect!
American poster: Hmm. Will you also agree to not post anything critical of the US until China is perfect?
Chinese poster / sympathizer: Of course I won't agree to that, I don't understand the concept of reciprocity!

Except substitute "Russian" for "Chinese" and "all of the stupid **** that Russia is doing or has recently done" for "the Tienanmen Square massacre" (or Mao's insane nonsense if we were digging back that far)

[Thoth]

Both usa and russia are ****holes.

[YoYoYoHeyyy]

Not if you're wealthy enough

[spambot]

First result on Google:

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/02/07/the-25-most-shocking-anti-gay-stories-from-russia-so-far/

The 25 most shocking anti-gay stories from Russia so far

1: Gay club attacked with ‘harmful gas’ by unknown assailants

When's the last time a club filled with black people got gassed?

2: Gay dating app blocked, users threatened with arrest

When has the US government ever shut down dating services for black people or interracial relationships?

3: Three men sentenced for stabbing and setting alight man they believed was gay

To Russia's credit, the government still frowns upon killing gay people.

4: Newspaper editor fined under anti-gay law for printing ‘being gay is normal’

When's the last time a newspaper was fined for saying black people are just as good as white people?

5: Tortured and killed gay man ‘raped with beer bottles’

Another anti-gay murder.

6: The Russian gangs who hunt gay people for sport

Oh but he survived so it's no big deal.

7: Police colluded with Neo-Nazis at 2011 Moscow Pride protests

Russia's fascist government seems to get along well with Nazis

8: Russian MP calls for law allowing gays to be whipped in public squares

When's the last time a member of the US congress called for laws allowing black people to be beaten?

9: Russian paratroopers violently attacked lone gay rights activist in St Petersburg

Nice to see members of the Russian military protecting Russian citizens.

10: Father imprisoned gay teen son in rehab clinic after a witch failed to exorcise his homosexuality

Locked up for being gay. Nice.

I'm really shocked to see Russia's human rights record comparing so poorly with the US

[Hauldren Collider]

The USA isn't even a ****hole if you're poor, something Thoth perfectly well knows.

Not that we're perfect, but holy hell you'd have to be a moron to think we can even be compared to Russia.

[YoYoYoHeyyy]

Just for fun, we should try enacting a three-day moratorium (that number is negotiable) on posting about stupid **** in the US, Russia, and China (included because it's a superpower and therefore tends to do stupid ****). Any other country is fair game. "France's subsidized subsistence farmers aren't happy again, lol." "The British royal family is still doing stupid stuff." "The Ukraine got nuked by Russia last night" - actually, that one wouldn't pass muster under the moratorium guidelines, it would have to be "The Ukraine got nuked by A Neighboring Country last night." And so on. Then at the end of the moratorium we could decide if the forum was better or worse under the moratorium.

[Hauldren Collider]

I don't think anyone is objecting to threads criticizing the US or US government. I certainly wouldn't, I've posted many such threads myself. What people are mocking in this thread, or at least what I am mocking, is Ellestar's (and when present, Serb's) insistence on justifying the truly deplorable state of his country with tangential references to comparatively minor incidents in America.

The point is really that while America has problems, and they deserve to be solved, you have to have your head so far up your ass you can taste your esophagus if you think that China or Russia are equal or better.

[YoYoYoHeyyy]

Some legitimate ways of addressing with a moral criticism:

1. Justify why the person is not qualified to make the criticism - note that the criticism may still be valid, though, so use this very sparingly. Also, this is easily abused / misapplied.
Example:
Poster: Russians should stop beating up homosexuals
Ellestar: Haven't you personally murdered a dozen homosexuals?
Poster: Yeah, but it's okay when I do it
Ellestar: I don't think you're qualified to be making this criticism

Poor Example:
American Poster: The Tienanmen Square massacre was a bad thing
Urban Ranger: America nuked Japan, therefore Americans aren't allowed to criticize anything short of use of nuclear weapons

2. Explain that you're not on board with the moral tenet that's being violated
Example:
Poster: Russians should stop beating up homosexuals - it's a human rights violation
Ellestar: I don't care about human rights
Poster: Fair enough

3. Explain how the moral tenet in question opposes some other (presumably more important) moral tenet
Example:
Poster: Russians should stop beating up homosexuals - it's a human rights violation
Ellestar: The rights of True Russians to be bigoted violent dickbags outweighs the rights of homosexuals to suck each others' dicks

4. Agree with the criticism
Example:
Poster: Russians should stop being up homosexuals
Ellestar: Yup, we should

[Thoth]

Not if you're wealthy enough

Well yes of course. They are both plutocracies after all.

The USA isn't even a ****hole if you're poor, something Thoth perfectly well knows.

Wake me up when you get some decent social programs, universal healthcare and a political system that offers actual choices to voters.

[Dinner]

Well, at least they haven't blown any suspects in custody up for a few months.

[Ellestar]

Poster: Russians should stop beating up homosexuals - it's a human rights violation
Ellestar: I don't care about human rights
Poster: Fair enough

I'm okay with human rights, i'm not ok with giving homosexuals more human rights than other people. Every category of people happens to be a victim of crimes, there is no need to specifically talk about crimes against homosexuals. Everyone is already equally protected by the law.