Republican efforts to destroy science continue apace..

[-Jrabbit]

Gun owners, teachers, auto workers, and banksters aren't constituents? They're merely more effectively organized than constituents without an interest group representing them, which probably explains why congresspeople pay more attention to their views.

One of the big lies of American political discourse is the idea of nefarious "special interest groups" who are undermining the will of the people. Interest groups are the people, and a populace that wants change so long as it doesn't affect their own interests (which is every interest, in the aggregate) is getting exactly what it wants.

So the failure of background checks to pass congress despite 90%-ish approval rating is... the fault of the people who favor these checks, because they're not "effectively organized"?? Nice.

Your conceit -- that the totality of special interest groups somehow magically define the interests of people as a whole -- is disingenuous at best. This "let the market decide" approach to politics, while intellectually appealing on some level, just does not pass the sniff test, because most people are not that organized, and don't have disposable income to contribute to a "lobby for regular Joes." And amazingly, that does not mean that their opinion shouldn't count.

The simple fact is, those who scream the loudest, distribute the most money (lobbying, bribes, etc), and who threaten and deliver retribution for slights, are the ones most likely to get their legislative way.

[Tupac Shakur]

God Sava, your performance in this thread was so disappointing...

[Tupac Shakur]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bureaucracy

Will you ***** please do me a favor and kill yourselves?

This post will be getting my thanks once I get it back.

[Tupac Shakur]

I think you need to go away and relearn what the words federal and bureaucracy mean.

You should take your own advice, dumb****...

A bureaucracy is a group of non-elected officials within a government or other institution that implements the rules, laws, ideas, and functions of their institution.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bureaucracy

Congress is a body of elected officials that creates the laws that the federal bureaucracy implements.

[Tupac Shakur]

Who do you think your congresspeople pay more attention to? You and your fellow constituents, or the NRA/Teacher's Unions/UAW/name-a-bank-here/etc etc etc

Gun owners, teachers, auto workers, and banksters aren't constituents? They're merely more effectively organized than constituents without an interest group representing them, which probably explains why congresspeople pay more attention to their views.

One of the big lies of American political discourse is the idea of nefarious "special interest groups" who are undermining the will of the people. Interest groups are the people, and a populace that wants change so long as it doesn't affect their own interests (which is every interest, in the aggregate) is getting exactly what it wants.

[Sava]

Yes. You are victorious in being wrong.

My bad for trying to raise your IQ into the triple digits. The old saying is true, you just can't fix stupid.

[giblets]

I'm glad you're giving up and admitting defeat

[Sava]

Wtf? A good reason to bypass the first definition?

And it's not an argument. It's two guys not knowing the meaning of a word. Congress is part of "the federal bureaucracy"... by definition.

I'm done with this threadjack. You are hopelessly brain dead.

[giblets]

Are you this stupid? The structure of a corporation is a bureaucracy. A rotary club is a bureaucracy. THOSE ARE REAL THINGS MORON

And...? You've still failed to give us a good reason to bypass the first definition, the one that pertains directly to the government, when talking about the government. Remember, the whole argument was over whether Congress is part of "the federal bureaucracy".

[Sava]

As opposed to the other definitions which referred to bureaucracy as an abstract concept. The first one is a description of an actual concrete thing and actually appropriate for determining who is or isn't a bureaucrat.. Moron.

Are you this stupid? The structure of a corporation is a bureaucracy. A rotary club is a bureaucracy. THOSE ARE REAL THINGS MORON

[DaShi]

As far as the inefficiency of the government bureaucracy (the part that is blamed on the federal government), a significant portion of it is due to the congressional part.

Maybe even the majority.

A lot of the rules that hamper the bureaucrats that I know, and keep them inefficient, are put in place by congress.

JM

The contractor system is also to blame. There are no bigger rent-seekers than government contractors.

[DaShi]

The problem with the US bureaucracy is that each department has its own culture and political agenda among the career people, who then hire/advance other career people with the same agenda, and it's difficult for Congress or sometimes even the President to break them into doing what they're supposed to be doing as per the goals of the political leadership that was actually elected by the people. Case in point, moving the Israeli embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem hasn't happened primarily because of State Department resistance, despite every president making it an election or re-election promise to move the embassy.

This is inaccurate because each department is led by politicals, who are not "career people" in this sense. The "career people" you are referring to are the lower ranking employees who are difficult to get rid. Many of them are extremely inefficient and unqualified for their positions and are incompetent with impunity. At best, they are pushed into meaningless positions. Upper-management in the government feels the heat of the political appointees, who are their administer the president's agenda.

Conversely, in the private sector, the higher you are, the more incompetence you can get away with with little to no impact on your career. This is where you'll see a manager of a factory dumbly wondering why things aren't running smoothly while he spends his hours on a gaming forum.

[Jon Miller]

As far as the inefficiency of the government bureaucracy (the part that is blamed on the federal government), a significant portion of it is due to the congressional part.

Maybe even the majority.

A lot of the rules that hamper the bureaucrats that I know, and keep them inefficient, are put in place by congress.

JM

[Jon Miller]

As far as the inefficiency of the government bureaucracy (the part that is blamed on the federal government), a significant portion of it is due to the congressional part.

Maybe even the majority.

A lot of the rules that hamper the bureaucrats that I know, and keep them inefficient, are put in place by congress.

JM

[giblets]

Yes. The one that only specifies nonelective government officials IN ONE PART OF ONE DEFINITION
I was responding to DD, not reg.

You and DD seem to have serious reading comprehension issues. It's mind boggling how dumb people can be.

Anyways, good luck with that whole stupid thing. It seems to be working well for you. Moron.

As opposed to the other definitions which referred to bureaucracy as an abstract concept. The first one is a description of an actual concrete thing and actually appropriate for determining who is or isn't a bureaucrat.. Moron.