Are the rich paying their 'fair' share?

[Al B. Sure!]

I'm sorry. Your (and HC's) argument was that the benefits of living in a low-crime area are paid for by the much higher real estate taxes paid.

Of course the government does extort them into paying higher property taxes than people living in the ghetto.

I think that has more to do with living in a nice neighborhood (something that is taxed, by the way) than being rich.

When it was shown that the Philly property tax rate is higher than Fairfax's, you pointed to absolute value.

When I showed that the difference in absolute dollars paid by homeowners in the two areas is a mere $1000/year and that couldn't possibly account for the fact that 19133 has SIX TIMES the crime rate of Fairfax... you now say what exactly?

You're going to have to explain.

[giblets]

So we should punish people for saving their money instead of spending it now with taxes on investment income because saving might enable them to live in a less ****ty neighborhood where they won't get mugged?

[Al B. Sure!]

QFT

Yup. I won this argument.

That's just one non-monetary advantage to being rich.

[Jon Miller]

Obviously the people who are wealthier are just smarter/better than those who are poorer. That is why they are so good at making more income. It has nothing to do with the advantages of wealth, which have been well documented in studies/etc.

JM

[giblets]

Yup. I won this argument.

That's just one non-monetary advantage to being rich.

You've defeated yourself. And once again reminded us of your poor life choices.

[giblets]

Obviously the people who are wealthier are just smarter/better than those who are poorer. That is why they are so good at making more income. It has nothing to do with the advantages of wealth, which have been well documented in studies/etc.

JM

I think there is a correlation between intelligence and income. So yes, the wealthy are smarter on average.

[Al B. Sure!]

So we should punish people for saving their money instead of spending it now because it might enable them to live in a less ****ty neighborhood where they won't get mugged?

Median household income 19133: $16,206
Median household income 20151: $103,899

It's not easy to save when your household income is $16K

[Jon Miller]

I must be stupid if I think money is only useful for obtaining goods and services.

I had a non-direct relative who (my age) quit being a teacher and became a vice-president of a major US corporation (I think there were a couple of years in between).

I am sure this had nothing to do with him being from a wealthy family and everything to do with his rare ability.

JM

[giblets]

Median household income 19133: $16,206
Median household income 20151: $103,899

It's not easy to save when your household income is $16K

If you earn minimum wage you should probably consider investing in yourself.

[Al B. Sure!]

Oh yeah and let's compare cost of living in 19133 vs. 20151 (100 is national index):

19133:
Food: 128
Utilities: 132
Misc.: 121

20151:
Food: 111
Utilities: 101
Misc.: 99

Hmm... so the non-housing cost of living in Philly is higher than Fairfax!

http://www.bestplaces.net/cost_of_living/city/pennsylvania/philadelphia

http://www.bestplaces.net/cost_of_living/zip-code/virginia/chantilly/20151

[Jon Miller]

Many of the people who make a low wage, only have low wage jobs available so that some capitalist can have a higher rate of return.

I pay a tax on the gain from my labor.

The capitalist should pay a tax on the gain from my labor too.

JM

[Al B. Sure!]

Let's summarize...

In absolute dollars, 20151 residents pay an extra $1000 on property taxes compared to 19133 residents who pay nearly THREE TIMES the tax rate!

19133 residents pay city wage tax of ~4% and sales tax of 8%; Fairfax has no city wage tax (???) and a sales tax of 5%.

19133 residents live in an area with SIX TIMES the crime rate 20151 residents experience.

Median household income in 19133 is 15% that of 20151. Fairfax residents make OVER SIX TIMES as much money.

YET, non-housing costs in Philly are HIGHER than in Fairfax...

and you're saying what now about consumption and saving?


I'm pretty sure I've just demonstrated that the advantages associated with living in a wealthy neighborhood (namely low crime exposure) are NOT paid for through taxation or anything else.


Ergo, a non-monetary, non-taxable privilege of being wealthy!

[giblets]

Many of the people who make a low wage, only have low wage jobs available so that some capitalist can have a higher rate of return.

I pay a tax on the gain from my labor.

The capitalist should pay a tax on the gain from my labor too.

JM

Okay. If consumption is taxed then everyone who gains from your labor will get taxed.

[Hauldren Collider]

Jon has successfully observed that smart people occasionally underachieve and that sometimes talent is not optimally selected, thereby "proving" that intelligence doesn't have to do with income.

[giblets]

Let's summarize...

Median household income in 19133 is 15% that of 20151. Fairfax residents make OVER SIX TIMES as much money.

YET, non-housing costs in Philly are HIGHER than in Fairfax...

and you're saying what now about consumption and saving?

Get a job in Fairfax. Get a house with a mortgage. Through the power of saving you will pay off the mortgage and will be able to go on midnight stroll if you so desire.