Russian presidential elections are faked already.

[Serb]

I hope you understand the principle of vote confidentiality.

We do. There were no cameras in the cabins. I once tried to enter the same cabin with my wife and was imminently stopped by the policeman. When you vote you are all alone. Nobody watches you and nobody can check how you vote. That is just not possible. That's why every single man with a brain just laughs when he hears bullsh!t about someone "buying" votes. So you give me money and tell me to vote for this candidate - great I take your money and vote for my own and you will never knew how did I vote.
That makes "buying voices" idea completely unrealistic and just PLAIN STUPID.

What was the turnout?

48%.

65 % actually.

[onodera]

And since it's obviously you have no idea about our election law I guess I should enlighten you that aside their own observers every candidate (or every party like in case with parliamentary elections) delegate their own representative into the election committee. The election committee consist of representatives of candidates and NOBODY ELSE. After the voice count they sign a protocol and copy of that protocol is given to every representative of all candidates (the members of the election committee).
IF AT LEAST ONE member of the election committee doesn't sign the protocol the results on this polling station are not valid.
So it's GOD DAMN EASY for every candidate (or every party) to make their own count and compare it with the final results.
If there are any significant difference - you just show your own copies of protocols from all polling stations (and those protocols are signed by representatives of other candidates) to prove there was a fraud.
IT IS SO GOD DAMN EASY TO PROVE IF THERE WAS A FRAUD.

You obviously have no idea either. The election committee doesn't necessarily consist of representatives of candidates. However, there have been at least SEVENTY ONE court cases in Moscow alone where there HAVE been such representatives that HAVE managed to obtain their copies of the protocols and the results in them HAVE been different from the ones in GAS Vybory. Guess what the verdicts were? Every single one of them said: "A technical error in manual data entry, no one is to blame." EVERY vote for EVERY party was different, with UR getting a lot more. That's not a technical error in my book.

[onodera]

So you give me money and tell me to vote for this candidate - great I take your money and vote for my own and you will never knew how did I vote.
That makes "buying voices" idea completely unrealistic and just PLAIN STUPID.

I am your boss, and I tell you to send me an MMS with a photo of your marked ballot, because MY boss told me I had to get everyone to vote for Party X. Don't, and you'll get laid off, for example. Or even better, I tell you to get an otkrepitelnoye, so you can vote here at the plant, where the election committee is controlled by the plant manager who had promised to achieve a good rating for Party X in exchange for his ass in the chair or a large government order.
But all this ballot stuffing is small change when you can simply adjust the final figures. That's why I've said in the previous thread that we need to have an end-to-end auditable vote tally system so anyone can count them.

[Serb]

Also the video cameras inside wouldn't have caught what the BBC did. People voting in multiple districts and being buses around so they can all vote multiple times.

Serb, you really should watch the BBC video because they do a good job following one bus around.

As for the buses and the same bullsh!t. The cameras can perfectly catch that. If the same people vote on different polling stations and you assume there were OMG MILLIONS OF THEM - you CANNNOT miss that on cameras. You'll see the same people on differents pollins stations voting over and over again.
Next thing. You f*cking kidding me? You think you can just came to the station and say - "give me a ballot I want to vote?". And that's all?
You vote at YOUR voting station where you are included in the list of voters. You show your passport, they check the data from you passport if you are in the list of voters or not. If you are they give you a ballot, you sign the paper that you got your ballot. If you are not in the list - get the **** out. YOU JUST CAN'T come to any station and vote.
Next thing. You don't understand that presidential election were not the only election which were held at that day. We also elected deputies to our cities parliaments. There were three ballots: one for presidential elections, and two for local parliament (one party list, one for district candidates). Now ask yourself, even if that bus bullsh!t was possible, what is is more realistic: an attempt to fraud in SINGLE election district to gain a seat in a city parliament (it's I don't know 20 000 voters at max) or an attempt to make a fraud of presidential election (100 million voters).
Don't you realize you can't hire TENS of MILLIONS of people and hundreds of thousands of buses to make you a president?

YOU JUST CANNOT. It's not POSSIBLE.
And why the hell you need that, if EVERY opinion poll, even the opposition ones, gave you a clear victory BEFORE the elections?

[Dinner]

4. Russian national character includes patience as one of the main traits. It's always been the same cycle: years of oppression, then rivers of blood. A lot of people prefer the former to the latter.

I can certainly understand that, I mean, who wants rivers of blood and the resulting destruction? On the other hand I look at the history of the UK and other western European countries and see that the whole rivers of blood & civil war thing can be fairly easily avoided if the establishment just gives in a little every now and then. If they at least try to keep things fair and above board then people refuse to resort to violence and instead try to work with in the system. The nobility in the UK undoubtedly didn't want to give more and more of their power away to common people but they wanted civil war less so they just slowly and gradually opted to give in to the opposition when they had to and thus in 1848 and many other years when the rest of Europe was involved in bloody up risings the British were living in peace and prosperity. The French, Germans, Austro-Hungarians, Italians, etc... where digging up the streets to make barricades and fight battles against the autocrats in the streets while in London people's biggest concern was which restaurant they should eat lunch at today. I like to think there is something to that approach which saves a lot of pain and suffering over the long run.

[MRT144]

Like it is not anywhere else. Welcome to the golden edge of capitalism.
But how corruption correlates with all those lies about our elections?
You propaganda machine just lies to you. Just like it lied about the Georgian invasion to South Ossetia. Just like it lied about Saddam's WMD. Lies, lies, lies and one more time lies. You repeat the lie a thousand times and it becomes true in heads of mindless zombies. And the bigger the lie, the sooner they'll buy it. That's how your mass-media works. Old good Dr. Goebbels recipes.

You know, not everyone in the United States believed the lies about WMD in Iraq. Does everyone in Russia believe that Putin wins without fraud?

[Serb]

What makes you think that delegates can't be bribed or intimidated?

Then it's a problem of that candidate. If he want to win he must pick people who can't be bribed or intimidated to represent his interests.

More importantly, what would have happened if Putin had lost the election?

He couldn't, because he has support of absolute majority of population.
But if he lose - welcome to the USSR. The only candidate who can be more or less a rival for Putin is Zyuganov and the only party which can be a competitor for United Russia is the Communist Party of Russian Federation.
Keep ****ing dreaming about the liberal revanche in Russia. All those Ryzhkovs, Kasyanovs (who are an ICONIC figures wrt corruption, esp Misha 2%) Navalny and the same motherf*ckers - your fifth column and your version of the "National Transitional Council of Russia" has support of 2% of bastards like them and perhaps another 5% of idiots like Onodera who just went crazy and don't realize he and people like him are just pawns in another man's game, that they are manipulated. That's all what your imbecile rules can count of. We are not Lybia. You did that with us 20 years ago. We won't buy the same bull**** again.

If Putin lose, communists took the power. Simple as that.

[MRT144]

So basically you're either a pawn of Putin or a pawn of another corrupt person like Putin.

[Serb]

You obviously have no idea either. The election committee doesn't necessarily consist of representatives of candidates.

Bull****. You want me to quote a law for you?

However, there have been at least SEVENTY ONE court cases in Moscow alone where there HAVE been such representatives that HAVE managed to obtain their copies of the protocols and the results in them HAVE been different from the ones in GAS Vybory. Guess what the verdicts were? Every single one of them said: "A technical error in manual data entry, no one is to blame." EVERY vote for EVERY party was different, with UR getting a lot more. That's not a technical error in my book.

Yeah, right, just like 16 millions of votes have been stolen.
I'm tired of that crap. Keep your bullsh!t for your western masters. Pawn.

[Dinner]

Serb, I admire your zeal and patriotism, those are definitely qualities a person should have, I just wish your current government was worthy of your hard work and efforts on their behalf.

[Serb]

I am your boss, and I tell you to send me an MMS with a photo of your marked ballot, because MY boss told me I had to get everyone to vote for Party X. Don't, and you'll get laid off, for example. Or even better, I tell you to get an otkrepitelnoye, so you can vote here at the plant, where the election committee is controlled by the plant manager who had promised to achieve a good rating for Party X in exchange for his ass in the chair or a large government order.
But all this ballot stuffing is small change when you can simply adjust the final figures. That's why I've said in the previous thread that we need to have an end-to-end auditable vote tally system so anyone can count them.

I vote since 1996. Do you honestly believe in your own bullsh!t? If you do... for **** sake, man. It's even worse than any other conspiracy theories. Tens of millions of voters bribed and forced to send MMS to their evil bosses.
Damn. Don't you realize you sound like a complete idiot?
Btw, I have a foil hat for sale, if you are interested.

[Serb]

Oh great!

I can certainly understand that, I mean, who wants rivers of blood and the resulting destruction? On the other hand I look at the history of the UK and other western European countries and see that the whole rivers of blood & civil war thing can be fairly easily avoided if the establishment just gives in a little every now and then. If they at least try to keep things fair and above board then people refuse to resort to violence and instead try to work with in the system. The nobility in the UK undoubtedly didn't want to give more and more of their power away to common people but they wanted civil war less so they just slowly and gradually opted to give in to the opposition when they had to and thus in 1848 and many other years when the rest of Europe was involved in bloody up risings the British were living in peace and prosperity. The French, Germans, Austro-Hungarians, Italians, etc... where digging up the streets to make barricades and fight battles against the autocrats in the streets while in London people's biggest concern was which restaurant they should eat lunch at today. I like to think there is something to that approach which saves a lot of pain and suffering over the long run.

That's because your nobility started to f*ck people abroad instead of f*cking its own common people. They needed their common people to murder and rob the common people of America, India, Australia and the other parts of the British Empire. The simpliest deal ever - we stop to f*ck you and instead start to use you to f*ck the tribals (who of course are not as humans as you "White men"). And aside proud and glory (well, and death sometimes) we even allow you to have your little piece of plunder so you can pick your restaurant.
Bloodsucking parasites, a perfect teachers of modern US of A. Father like son.

[Felch]

If Putin isn't cheating, then he's doing a disservice to political machine bosses everywhere.

Making the rest of us look bad

[Fake Boris]

Then it's a problem of that candidate. If he want to win he must pick people who can't be bribed or intimidated to represent his interests.

And you still don't see how ironic that is.

[Serb]

Serb, I admire your zeal and patriotism, those are definitely qualities a person should have, I just wish your current government was worthy of your hard work and efforts on their behalf.

Oh sh!t. You think I'm a Putin's fanboy or something?
I AM A COMMIE, GOD DAMN YOU. I have never EVER voted for Putin or United Russia before. But I DID NOW.
I'm not defending my government or Putin.

I AM DEFENDING THE TRUTH.