Clement Attlee was not a good Prime Minister. Discuss.

[kentonio]

Paul Ryan's plan.

Good point. That certainly does suck regardless of any alternatives.

[Hauldren Collider]

You must not understand it or know anything about it. The status quo is untenable, and medicare and medicaid are unraveling. The Ryan plan would prevent that. It's not an option between Ryan's plan and the current system, because the current system will not be around in 20 years regardless.

The Ryan plan makes two major changes: Rich people don't get as much in benefits, and it establishes a cap on how much people can spend by implementing a voucher system. This is necessary. You can't have unlimited medical spending. At least with a voucher system people will make more intelligent decisions about what medical care they actually need.

[DaShi]

Paul Ryan's plan is barely that. First, it actually offers no solutions beyond, "Cut Medicare/Medicaid." Second, simply cutting those programs will not reduce medical costs or inefficiency in the healthcare system. In fact, there's a strong possibility it would make it worse.

[giblets]

I don't understand how a voucher system for health care is supposed to work. Are they giving you X amount of dollars to buy health insurance from a private company?

[DaShi]

It doesn't work.

[Hauldren Collider]

I don't understand how a voucher system for health care is supposed to work. Are they giving you X amount of dollars to buy health insurance from a private company?

Yes, that's my understanding. I think it would also have a voucher for expenditures not covered by insurance. I'm not 100% on the details anymore. Bottom line is that it would end the ability to make unlimited claims on medicare and medicaid.

[Hauldren Collider]

A few months ago I would have been able to go into intricate detail, but I've forgotten since because I've had other things to keep track of. Sue me.

[giblets]

Yes, that's my understanding. I think it would also have a voucher for expenditures not covered by insurance. I'm not 100% on the details anymore. Bottom line is that it would end the ability to make unlimited claims on medicare and medicaid.

Do you think insurance companies do a good job of getting doctors to make cost effective decisions and avoid waste?

[DaShi]

A few months ago I would have been able to go into intricate detail, but I've forgotten since because I've had other things to keep track of. Sue me.

No, you've never went into intricate detail and every time you were challenged on it you ran away.

[Boris Godunov]

Sounds like sour grapes from a guy who lost an election to Clement Atlee.

Yes, because if history has shown one thing, it's that Sir Winston Churchill's historical legacy has been completely overshadowed by that of Clement Atlee.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

it establishes a cap on how much people can spend by implementing a voucher system. This is necessary. You can't have unlimited medical spending. At least with a voucher system people will make more intelligent decisions about what medical care they actually need.

So they could economise by, for example, skipping their vaccinations?

I'm also interested to hear how it treats patients with dementia or other serious mental health conditions. How do they go about making those important decisions?

[Tupac Shakur]

Paul Ryan's plan is barely that. First, it actually offers no solutions beyond, "Cut Medicare/Medicaid." Second, simply cutting those programs will not reduce medical costs or inefficiency in the healthcare system. In fact, there's a strong possibility it would make it worse.

Medicare and Medicaid are the primary drivers of increasing budget deficits, so any serious plan to reduce future deficits obviously requires reform of those programs, reforms you would almost certainly consider "cuts".

This is off-topic, however, so I would ask that you and HC start a new thread or continue this discussion in one of the many healthcare reform or budget deficit threads. Thank you.

[DaShi]

Thank you for not contributing to the discussion.

[molly bloom]

Yes, because if history has shown one thing, it's that Sir Winston Churchill's historical legacy has been completely overshadowed by that of Clement Atlee.

Could you tell us what you think Churchill's historical legacy to be ?

And what you know of Attlee's ?

[Tupac Shakur]

Churchill is remembered throughout the world as one of the world's greatest wartime leaders.

Almost no one outside England knows who Clement Attlee was, because he didn't do anything worth remembering.