Rapture Question

[Kidlicious]

Sure thing. Do we have any Rapture believers here--Kid, maybe? I always thought the doctrine was based mostly on one passage in an epistle of Peter's, but trying to follow the different opinions in Wiki's article on the matter is causing my brain to explode.

I do believe in the rapture because of what the book of Revelations says. The verses you are refering to are talking about Second Advent. That seems clear. The thing that I wonder about is what type of christians will be left behind after the Rapture. Maybe they are those with the strongest faith.

[Elok]

Wait, so some Christians will be left on earth? I admit all I know about the rapture is pretty thirdhand, from reading plot summaries of those Left Behind books and the like.

[Kidlicious]

Yes some are left to suffer for the Lords glory.

[Elok]

Is there any rubric for who stays and who goes? And what's the justification for any number going ahead of the full, loud, absolute-end-of-the-world second coming, anyway? The 1 Corinthians verse above seems to say clearly--to me--that everybody's going to be staying here until Christ comes in glory.

[Kidlicious]

Honestly I have to look for the verses.

[Kidlicious]

Revelations 3 talks about the rapture (phase 1). Revelations 11 talks about the trumpet call (phase 2). Most christians who believe in the rapture believe the more faithful are taken, but its doesn't sound right to me. Why would the more faithful be taken, and the lessor christians left to endure the Tribulation.

[Imran Siddiqui]

If you are reading Rev 3 as proof of Rapture then you'd have to say the more faithful are taken (Rev 3:10). If you rather, like myself, look at the context and see they are specific letters to churches in Asia Minor and thus there is something more than some far future apocalypse, it is more interesting.

[Kidlicious]

If you are reading Rev 3 as proof of Rapture then you'd have to say the more faithful are taken (Rev 3:10). If you rather, like myself, look at the context and see they are specific letters to churches in Asia Minor and thus there is something more than some far future apocalypse, it is more interesting.

Lets look at the description. They are described as having little strength (low social status), good deeds, and endurance (probably due to false witness). So yeah one could say they have strong faith, yet they aren't chosen to endure the greatest hardship, the Tribulation. Others are chosen for that, possible those with some different qualities and experiences.

[Berzerker]

some of you will have lived 2000 years after both Jesus' birth and death

[Kidlicious]

Nnnnnnooooo

[Kidlicious]

Hey Berz, are you a New Age Spiritualist?

[Dinner]

What if I feel like being rude here? Huh, Elok?

[Elok]

Then it wouldn't be the first time. Nevertheless, please restrain yourself. Kid, I'll have to get back to you on this, dinner is imminent and it's been a long day.

[Elok]

Okay, Rev. 3:10 seems somewhat ambiguous: "Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth." I can see how that could be read to mean "I'll take you away from the Earth while all the bad stuff is going on," but the rest of Revelation goes into great detail about the bad stuff and doesn't mention such an event AFAIK--plus it seems to contradict the more explicit verse from 1 Corinthians. Is there another verse which supports this idea? I'm only asking out of curiosity, not trying to attack your beliefs or anything.

I should mention that, while I read Revelation as a teenager for all the cool bits about giant agony-locusts, the OC has a somewhat uncomfortable relationship with the book--it's the ONLY book in the Bible we don't read from in any way during services. The general fear is that unguided exposure to the book would lead people to come up with all sorts of wackadoo theories. Anyway, I'm not terribly well-versed in Revelation, just letting you know.

[Berzerker]

Hey Berz, are you a New Age Spiritualist?

Nnnnnnooooo