Facing betrayal - an idiot or zen?

[Pekka]

double post

[DaShi]

Good luck with this Pekka. Also, keep my advice in mind, if only as a backup plan.

[Provost Harrison]

Exactly! I've been trying the whole Zen thing lately, to be calm about everything and negative things happen, that's the way it is and now forward, if I let it hurt my mind I'm paying a price that is unnecessary. That is, I'm doing the damage to myself, while I could be Zen with it and feel good, live long and prosper.

F**k Zen, take them to the cleaners - it's a dog eat dog world, and let's start, they have tried eating your dog first...it's unprofessional. But then again this is academia for you, I am so glad I left when I did.

[Provost Harrison]

I'm totally covered, at least by definition.

I read what plagiarism is from the Scientific research ethical board (or something like that) POV here in this country. It was very clear about what it is. It even starts with "unauthorized use of research plan, manuscript, article, or other text, or part of a text being presented as their own. Then there is even a step further which could be the case here, which is misappropriation (in my language they actually use the term 'stealing' as separate from plagiarism): "confidential and original research ideas', plans', or observations' unauthorized use, or partial use, in their own name".

Now, plagiarism is a clear one here, misappropriation could be argued, which is more severe as it is purposeful misleading of other researchers, scientific community, funders and decision makers. Which is exactly what would happen here. In either case, it's a definite no go. I still haven't heard from him.
"

You hold them by the balls, so they need to do something for you in return. Negotiate out of them what you want.

[Pekka]

You hold them by the balls, so they need to do something for you in return. Negotiate out of them what you want.

Exactly my current thoughts.

At first, I figured I'd want to work with the project and I just need to let the young PM know that what he is doing is just not the way things are done. And then he'd come up with a solution. Still haven't heard from him.

So I'm starting to be at a point where negative feelings are starting to reroute from pointing at myself to the project itself. As in I don't want anything to do with this ****. This is a good indicator of what is to come - I have learned that lesson to the extreme. I will not repeat the same mistake. There is no malicious intent, it's just pure incompetence and lack of thought. But that leads us all to hell in the end and we will all pay the price of those **** ups that could have been avoided.

In other words, if they want to do this, it's time to propose and negotiate, I'm all ears as to what would be beneficial to me. Time is running out though. But it is not, fortunately for me, my problem anymore.

[Pekka]

Well, he just now promised to call me in a few...

[Krill]

Yeah, that's Plagiarism for sure. Go get 2 bricks and tell him what you are going to do to him.

[Wezil]

F**k Zen, take them to the cleaners - it's a dog eat dog world, and let's start, they have tried eating your dog first...it's unprofessional. But then again this is academia for you, I am so glad I left when I did.

"It's a dog eat dog word and I'm wearing Milk Bone underwear." - Norm

[Pekka]

Well, that thing surely sucked, but we negotiated a deal.

No money in it for me, but all other credit plus no responsibility (unless I want to). So I'll get it to my CV in any case, plus they need to do something else with the plan that I particularly wanted to, and I'll take that part and just take it somewhere else instead. In short, I have my fingers around that project but I also get my own project should I prepare one later on with someone else. These were conditions so they can apply. Any non-compliance later on will be handled.

[notyoueither]

Good on you, Pekka.

[Elok]

Sounds good to me, as long as you're not really hurting for cash or anything.

[Pekka]

Sounds good to me, as long as you're not really hurting for cash or anything.

Well I figure I lost about 40k in that non-deal. It's a lot of money for me for sure. It's like a car plus down payment on a house. Or lots, LOTS of dvds, books and games. Or trips to abroad. Yet, somehow, the notion that you don't get credited even when you'd be an original major contributor (in fact the first one to contact everyone else about the issue), is hurtful.

Turns out that the guy didn't hold his end of the deal. So this is not over. I don't know if I'm more pissed off now than I was before, or pleased, that I have a clear case where he became guilty of misappropriation (as step to the deep end of the pool from plagiarism). He didn't change the plan at all, which was the 1st condition to which he agreed to. I'd say that's a wrap. I'm contemplating should I give him a third chance, just to let him know he has one more shot to make this right - what ever it is, re-submit the plan, which is an easy way off, less than one day's full work (re-write less than 2 pages). If he doesn't do that, does he really leave me any other option than to contact his boss? I don't think so. I've been very direct, I sent him emails today stating that the version you have now is not what we agreed, you need to do A, B and C to make it right. He didn't do it. Just couldn't be bothered.