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Final Proof that any Diplomacy whatsover with Israel is a complete waste of time!

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  • Final Proof that any Diplomacy whatsover with Israel is a complete waste of time!

    Palestine Papers - the latest leaks to go public!

    The Palestine Papers: Browse the documents

    Palestinian negotiators secretly agreed to allow Israel to annex all but one of the settlements built in occupied East Jerusalem in the most far-reaching concessions ever made over the bitterly contested city. The offer was turned down by Israel's then foreign minister as inadequate.

    Palestinian Authority leaders also privately discussed giving up part of the flashpoint Arab neighbourhood of Sheikh Jarrah, according to leaked documents. And they proposed a joint committee to take over the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount holy sites in the Old City of Jerusalem – the highly sensitive issue that, along with refugee rights, sank the Camp David talks in 2000 and triggered the second Palestinian intifada.

    The unprecedented offer on the East Jerusalem settlements, made in May 2008, is revealed in confidential Palestinian records of negotiations with Israel in the year before the Gaza war of 2008-09.

    Ahmed Qureia, the lead Palestinian negotiator, proposed that Israel annex all Jewish settlements in Jerusalem except Har Homa (Jabal Abu Ghneim) – and hammered home the significance of the concession.

    "This is the first time in history that we make such a proposition," he said at a meeting in the city's King David hotel. "We refused to do so in Camp David," he said, referring to the talks where the two sides had come closer than ever to an agreement.

    For many Palestinians it is anathema to agree to give up or even swap prime parts of the city they hope to make their capital. The settlements are regarded as illegal in international law and Israel's 1967 annexation of East Jerusalem has never been recognised internationally, though it is supported by a large majority of Israeli Jews – including many who back a West Bank withdrawal.

    But the Israeli negotiator Tzipi Livni is recorded as dismissing the offer out of hand because the Palestinians had refused to concede Har Homa, as well as the settlements at Ma'ale Adumim, near Jerusalem, and Ariel, deeper in the West Bank. Israel's position was fully supported by the Bush administration.

    "We do not like this suggestion because it does not meet our demands, and probably it was not easy for you to think about it, but I really appreciate it," Livni said.

    The Palestinians agreed that Israel could annex French Hill, Pisgat Ze'ev, Neve Ya'akov, Ramat Shlomo and Gilo near Bethlehem – all routinely described as "neighbourhoods" by Israel.

    Construction has continued rapidly in East Jersualem in defiance of Barack Obama's call for a freeze. Palestinian Authority leaders have publicly denounced the building work in areas it is now revealed they had agreed in principle to give up. Only last week the Israeli authorities gave the go-ahead for 1,400 new homes in Gilo.

    The Palestine Liberation Organisation's chief negotiator Saeb Erekat told the Israeli minister: "It is no secret that … we are offering you the biggest Yerushalayim [the Hebrew word for Jerusalem] in history. But we must talk about the concept of al-Quds [Jerusalem in Arabic]. We have taken your interests and concerns into account, but not all. This is the first time in Palestinian-Israeli history in which such a suggestion is officially made."

    The same document reveals that Qureia raised the possibility of the Palestinians conceding part of the predominantly Arab East Jerusalem neighbourhood of Sheikh Jarrah in return for land swaps in line with the pre-1967 map of Israel. The area has been a focus of conflict in recent months because of internationally condemned attempts by rightwing Israeli settlers to take over Palestinian homes.

    "So for an area in Sheikh Jarrah, I have to see [an] equivalent area," Qureia is recorded telling the Israeli negotiator Tal Becker in June 2008.

    On the most sensitive issue of the Old City's Muslim and Jewish religious sites, Erekat – then chief Palestinian negotiator – told US officials in October 2009 that he was prepared to consider "creative ways" to solve the problem of control of the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount. For Muslims across the world, the area is the most important in the conflict and Yasser Arafat's refusal to compromise over its sovereignty triggered the final breakdown at Camp David.

    "Even the Old City can be worked out except the Haram and what they call Temple Mount. There you need the creativity of people like me," he explained to US state department official David Hale, emphasising he was speaking in a personal capacity. "It's solved ... there are creative ways, having a body or a committee."

    The Palestine papers reveal the twists and turns of feverish talks throughout 2008, with the US closely involved. Condoleezza Rice, Bush's secretary of state, declared in mid-June that an agreement was possible by the end of the year. But the Palestinians complained that Israeli settlement activities were a "deadly" problem. "If they continue they will embarrass us before Palestinian public opinion and the Arab world," Qureia told her.

    The documents show how the negotiations were complicated by a private channel between the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, and Israel's prime minister, Ehud Olmert, who met without aides. In August 2008, Olmert offered Abbas a "package deal" that fell short of Palestinian demands, but it went beyond his negotiating brief and he was forced to resign the following month because of corruption allegations.

    Abbas's colleagues complained that they didn't know what happened in the leaders' talks. He was not even allowed to keep the map that accompanied the Israeli offer, the documents reveal.
    Final proof Israel doesn’t give a **** about the peace process…

    …while making the US its human shield at the same time (seriously, how does Israel have the US meekly by the balls in such a way - it beggars belief…!?)...

    When will people wake up?
    Is it me, or is MOBIUS a horrible person?

  • #2
    I also see in recent news that Israel has found that Israel did nothing wrong wrt the flotilla.

    I was absolutely astounded at the conclusion.
    "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
    "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

    Comment


    • #3
      Palestinian negotiators secretly agreed...

      But according to http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12263671

      Meanwhile, a spokesman for the Palestinian Authority, Yasser Abed Rabbo, refused to be drawn on whether the documents were authentic or not.

      "Today al-Jazeera has published what it says are documents it obtained from the PLO's negotiations directorate," he said.

      "We are not going to discuss the authenticity or lack of authenticity of these documents."


      Blah

      Comment


      • #4
        Not surprised.
        "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
        Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Wezil View Post
          I also see in recent news that Israel has found that Israel did nothing wrong wrt the flotilla.

          I was absolutely astounded at the conclusion.
          I am not. I think it is the correct conclusion.

          I don't agree with Israel's actions in the OP though.

          JM
          Jon Miller-
          I AM.CANADIAN
          GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

          Comment


          • #6
            Did the PNA, PLO or Hamas ever agree to recognize the state of Israel? Just checking
            Keep on Civin'
            RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

            Comment


            • #7
              Is Israel's inferiority complex so great they care about being recognized by them?
              "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
              Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Jon Miller View Post
                I am not. I think it is the correct conclusion.

                I don't agree with Israel's actions in the OP though.

                JM

                In your wildest nightmares could you have expected any other conclusion?

                Let me judge myself and you will find I am a saint.
                "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
                "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

                Comment


                • #9
                  I've been there a few times. The inhabitants are more paranoid than Americans (no offense to the Yanks). Youngsters regularly walk around on the streets with rifles. And I'm not talking about gang members - I'm talking about citizens that go to Starbucks. You can find militia and militaries on every block.

                  This is caused by their legends and tales of the promised land. No matter the cost, they must and shall have this piece of barren desert. All of it, not some of it. Think about it. Why would any group re-converge to the same place after threeeeeee-thoussaaaaaaand years. It's absurd. Only brainwashing can produce this.

                  At present, the Jews are the dominant force. They can achieve their goal by growing the Jewish population while making it difficult for the Arab population to develop and grow. And capturing Arab territory centimeter by centimeter. No need to negotiate if you're in control.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    1967 borders and UN-administered Jerusalem is the only solution other than mass genocide that will work.
                    Graffiti in a public toilet
                    Do not require skill or wit
                    Among the **** we all are poets
                    Among the poets we are ****.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      There's an easier solution: if the U.S. stops backing Israel, Israel will suddenly be the underdog and will have to play nice.

                      I wonder what will happen when we are no longer dependent on gasoline from the Middle East. There will be little political incentive for a peace process.

                      Comment

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