US Gun Laws

[The Mad Monk]

Believe it or not, the natives' guns were a source of concern for the military. The Wounded Knee massacre was a result of a weapons seizure gone wrong.

Especially ironic when you consider that many of the Eastern tribes' members were provided with a rifle apiece when they were moved west in the early 1800s.

[giblets]

No, I'm not saying that at all. The natives were attacked for their land, the Sioux in this case were chased off because of gold found in the Black Hills. However, they were armed, and the military considered it important to disarm them.

Yeah, so why do you keep insisting that owning guns protects people from oppression?

Look, gribbler, I'm sure that in your day to day life, you're used to being the smartest person in the room, and winning all your debates with ease. But this is Poly OT. And while we're not what we used to be, we're still a community made of people who have lived their entire lives being the smartest in the room. If you want to be respected round these parts, you need to step up your game.

[The Mad Monk]

Guns provide the oportunity. Nobody said it would be easy.

[Felch]

Oh my God. You've proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that owning firearms is not sufficient for maintaining liberty. Therefore you've proven that owning firearms is not necessary for maintaining liberty. That shatters my entire world view.

Roll your eyes all you want, but your entire debate strategy can be summed up in two words - straw man. You're friends might be impressed, but we've seen it all before. Welcome to Poly OT.

[giblets]

Show me evidence that firearms are an effective means of maintaining liberty. Oh wait, you think England is a police state. Never mind.

[Felch]

Watch Mad Monk's movie. It goes case by case showing countries in the 20th century with brutal dictatorships, and it examines their gun laws. Invariably the people are disarmed before they're slaughtered. It's just common sense, if you're going to mistreat people, make sure they're defenseless.

[giblets]

Why am I wasting my time with someone who wrote this little gem?

The British people are disarmed and pacified. The British police kill without consequence. This is exactly what gun rights are for. We don't bear arms to fight crime, we bear arms to fight our own government.

If that baffles you, it's because the Royal propaganda machine that Cort denies exists has gotten to you too.

Let me give an example of the British propaganda machine:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-12173614

That's a recent BBC piece on gun control. They interview one person, a gun control advocate, and he treats the second amendment as a historic anomaly of frontier life, and ignores the 1689 Bill of Rights and common law traditions. That sort of bull**** makes Fox News look respectable.

As far as Christian rednecks being terrorists, you're absolutely right, Asher. They're bad people. And like all terrorists, the world would be better off without them. Why not arm yourselves, and shoot the bastards? Nobody ever treated the Spartans or the Sacred Band of Thebes with any disrespect. Prove to the world that homosexual isn't the same thing as sissy.

What a nutjob.

[giblets]

Watch Mad Monk's movie. It goes case by case showing countries in the 20th century with brutal dictatorships, and it examines their gun laws. Invariably the people are disarmed before they're slaughtered. It's just common sense, if you're going to mistreat people, make sure they're defenseless.

Yeah, evil dictatorships are pretty good at disarming the people. Doesn't make guns very effective for protecting freedom.

[Felch]

Were the police officers involved in that murder ever brought to justice? No, they weren't.

Is the BBC a publicly financed media empire that feeds propaganda to the people? Yes, it is.

How is what I said incorrect?

And if guns were no good at protecting freedom, why don't evil dictatorships let people keep their guns? Maybe they know something you don't know. Or maybe they're just honest about the issue, while you're still hiding behind straw men and ad hominems.

[giblets]

Were the police officers involved in that murder ever brought to justice? No, they weren't.

Is the BBC a publicly financed media empire that feeds propaganda to the people? Yes, it is.

How is what I said incorrect?

Right, if you can find one example of a cop allegedly killing someone and not being found guilty, that country must be a police state where cops don't fear punishment...

And the way you portray the UK is what I find nutty.

And if guns were no good at protecting freedom, why don't evil dictatorships let people keep their guns? Maybe they know something you don't know. Or maybe they're just honest about the issue, while you're still hiding behind straw men and ad hominems.

If dictators couldn't use harsh measures to take away the guns then yeah, they would be helpful. The reason they're not very useful for protecting freedom is because dictators can choose not to let people keep their guns. Hell, read this thread...

It is supposed to demonstrate that it is indeed possible to disarm a country's population, but the process isn't going to be a democratic one, more of a "send in the Union army, violently suppress the resistance of state militia, execute those who refuse to give up their firearms, then send in the federal police (don't forget to create it in advance) to search for hidden caches, execute those who have created the caches, repeat several times". Bloody? Yes. Efficient? Yes. Enough federal political power to pull this off? No.

[Felch]

Onodera's country still hasn't managed to fully pacify Chechnya. And they followed pretty much the same strategy he outlines.

[giblets]

Onodera's country still hasn't managed to fully pacify Chechnya. And they followed pretty much the same strategy he outlines.

Looks pretty pacified to me.

[Hauldren Collider]

Looks pretty pacified to me.

Then you're an idiot. There were bombings in Moscow subways just a few months back over Chechnya. That ain't pacified.

[giblets]

Then you're an idiot. There were bombings in Moscow subways just a few months back over Chechnya. That ain't pacified.

How are bombings even relevant to gun control?

[Felch]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11571673

Shouting Islamist slogans, three fighters launched a bomb and gun attack as deputies arrived for work, killing two guards and an official.

All three attackers were killed, the Chechen and Russian authorities say.

Deputies inside the building managed to escape by moving to an upper floor. The attack was condemned by the EU and US.

They both pledged to work together with Russia to defeat "terrorism".

Correspondents say the incident in the capital Grozny is a reminder that the region is far from stable.

Last year Moscow declared victory against Chechen separatists and there has been a relative lull in the violence under Ramzan Kadyrov, Chechnya's Kremlin-backed leader.

But the whole North Caucasus is seeing an insurgency led by Islamist rebels, correspondents say.