they took the axe to my property today...

[Darius871]

As for eating during a depression, it's rather more civilized now. People get unemployment benefits until the storm clears. Of course, unemployment isn't much money for some people. And if you were self-employed, you're SOL.

And it's based on the assumption that the insurers and their reinsurers will remain perpetually solvent.

[snoopy369]

title fixed... Dis, there's never been a way to edit thread titles before, except in the first few minutes by editing the first post's subject. That never changed...

[SlowwHand]

He's such a rookie.

[DanS]

And it's based on the assumption that the insurers and their reinsurers will remain perpetually solvent.

Not sure as I understand this. Isn't unemployment insurance provided by Uncle Sam as soon as the state unemployment insurance runs out?

[Zkribbler]

When I was growing up, one of my favorite foods was "tamale pie," which came out of the Depression. IIRC, it was a pound of ground meat [cooked], then a lot of corn starch was added, along with some olives, canned corn, canned tomatoes and chili powder.

When I was really poor, I could stretch that one dish into dinner for a week. --I wonder what I did with the receipe.

[Darius871]

Not sure as I understand this. Isn't unemployment insurance provided by Uncle Sam as soon as the state unemployment insurance runs out?

Precisely my point.

[Darius871]

Then again they seem to be OK for now since China's as stupid as ever...

China to stick with US bonds
By Henny Sender in New York

Published: February 11 2009 23:33 | Last updated: February 11 2009 23:33

China will continue to buy US Treasury bonds even though it knows the dollar will depreciate because such investments remain its “only option” in a perilous world, a senior Chinese banking regulator said on Wednesday.

China has used the dollars it accumulates selling manufactured goods to US consumers to accumulate the world’s largest holding of Treasuries.

However, the increasing US budget deficit and its potential impact on the dollar have raised questions about the future Chinese appetite for US debt.

Luo Ping, a director-general at the China Banking Regulatory Commission, said after a speech in New York that China would continue to buy Treasuries in spite of its misgivings about US finances.

Mr Luo, speaking at the Global Association of Risk Management’s 10th Annual Risk Management Convention, said: “Except for US Treasuries, what can you hold?” he asked. “Gold? You don’t hold Japanese government bonds or UK bonds. US Treasuries are the safe haven. For everyone, including China, it is the only option.”

Mr Luo, whose English tends toward the colloquial, added: “We hate you guys. Once you start issuing $1 trillion-$2 trillion [$1,000bn-$2,000bn] . . .we know the dollar is going to depreciate, so we hate you guys but there is nothing much we can do.”

However, Mr Luo said Chinese officials would encourage its banks to finance domestic mergers and acquisitions rather than provide rescue finance to distressed financial companies in other countries: “There will be no bottom-fishing of financial institutions, particularly in the US, because there is a lot of uncertainty about the quality of the books.”

Mr Luo said China intends to maintain its separation of investment and commercial banking based on its observations of the US after repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act that enforced a similar division of banking activities.

“To some extent, Glass-Steagall has fuelled the crisis,” Mr Luo said. “The separation of commercial and investment banking is likely to stay longer [in China] than before.” Like senior financial officials in other developing nations – such as Mohammad Al Jasser, vice-governor of the Saudi Arabian Monetary Agency – Mr Luo also spoke out against what he called America’s laissez-faire capitalism.

“Government ownership was viewed as something negative but the pendulum is swinging the other way. Perhaps banking is [no different from] public utilities where government participation is necessary,” he said.

“Deregulation in the US has gone a little bit too far. The market can’t be omnipotent.”

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ba857be6-f...077b07658.html

[duke o' york]

Dis, I think you should move into the tourist industry, which is still pretty big in Vegas. Maybe try taming lions or practise your can-can.

[Alinestra Covelia]

I'd pay money to see Dis' can-can.

[snoopy369]

Actually, at least some parts of the tourist industry in Vegas are seeing real cutbacks... one of my friends has a friend who works in Vegas as a hostess, and her husband is a chef; there's a lot less tip money out there. If it weren't for the union-inflated hourly wages, she couldn't afford to live there...

[DanS]

Precisely my point.

OK. Got it.

[Blaupanzer]

50/50 the US treasury will default someday in my opinion. However, that day is more than 8 years from now. A sufficient injection of spending into the economy will bottom the economy and turn it to the positive. That is what WW II did the last time -- got FDR to spend enough money in a sufficiently short period of time. Obama, with less than a month in office, is trying to do that now.

The hypocrite party (nee: GOP) is actually trying to stop this due to the big hit on the debe. That debt is there, however, because Bush pissed away the large surplus we could have kept building at least 'til 9/11. Post that, he refused to pay for the war except by removing regulations and allowing the resulting false profits to be taxed at little, teeny rates. Hence big debt and collapsed economy due to the hypocrites.

[snoopy369]

While Bush spent a ton of money, the surplus wasn't 'large', and would have gone away regardless (see: 2001 economic mini-crash). Take away war spending, and the corresponding gains economically FROM that war spending, and we'd still have been well into the red. Clinton and the end-of-the-century Congressional Republicans deserve some credit for the surplus, certainly, but it was largely a result of good economic times.

[Darius871]

50/50 the US treasury will default someday in my opinion.

Just OOC, to anybody who might know, what precisely happens when a sovereign country defaults on its own treasury's debts? I keep hearing people talking about states or the U.S. going "bankrupt" but that's misleading since it's a legal term, and obviously the U.S. can't realistically file for bankruptcy in its own federal courts, nor could many of its assets realistically be liquidated (well, maybe you could sell some bombers, the White House, etc...). Similarly I presume creditors can't realistically sue the U.S. in its own federal courts, and judgments from foreign courts would be difficult to enforce against a sovereign country, aside from attaching whatever tangible and intangible assets it was stupid enough to leave overseas. Or would its citizens be as personally liable as their government? Not likely.

So what happens? Do lenders just stop investing in the defaulting country's T-bonds (per credit reporting agencies) and otherwise simply cut their losses? That doesn't sound too bad. I suppose Iceland would be instructive but it's too early to tell just where that's headed.

[snoopy369]

I think you're right on the money; foreign nations seize assets they can get their hands on (see Britain re: Iceland), and otherwise the bond holders are just ****ed. If it's a nation that has substantial ties to another nation in terms of resources (say, Ukraine to Russia re: natural gas), that other nation might hold its resource hostage until its citizens are paid off; so perhaps Saudi citizens are safe buying US bonds...