Why is lobbying even legal in the US?

[onodera]

I've been reading a lot about Obama's promises to combat special interests and lobbying, but what I can't understand is why it is legal to lobby in the first place.
As I see it, when a politician uses his status for his personal gain by favouring some business, he's a corrupt politician who should be at the very least fired and banned from any political activity or better shot or electrocuted.
Why hasn't been lobbying outlawed outright yet?

[Naked Gents Rut]

Lobbying won't be outlawed because it's a lucrative career option for retired American legislators.

[Kirnwaffen]

Well, how do you define lobbying? Technically, any citizen petitioning the government is lobbying. For a representative democracy to work, people have to be able to petition their reps, so banning lobbying is not a straight forward propositon.

[Kuciwalker]

It's impossible to draw a firm line between "using his status for personal gain by favoring some business" and "businesses contributing to candidates that already favor policies good for the business".

[Darius871]

Originally posted by Kirnwaffen
Well, how do you define lobbying? Technically, any citizen petitioning the government is lobbying. For a representative democracy to work, people have to be able to petition their reps, so banning lobbying is not a straight forward propositon.

Bingo. Banning bribes is one thing, but banning lobbying would be unconstitutional. The only differences between a lobbying "firm" and an individual petitioning the government are scale, connections, and experience AFAICS.

The problem isn't the lobbying process itself but rather the big money intermingled with it. No need to throw out the baby with the bathwater.

[Dr Strangelove]

I highly recommend the movie Thank You For Smoking . It's the best treatise on lobbying I've ever seen.

[onodera]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
It's impossible to draw a firm line between "using his status for personal gain by favoring some business" and "businesses contributing to candidates that already favor policies good for the business".

Outlaw both. Politicians should be on the government's payroll.

[Kuciwalker]

So what happens when a businessman independently runs ads supporting a candidate?

See, we have this "freedom of speech" thing.

[Deity Dude]

Here's why:

First Amendment of the US Constitution:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

The pertinent part for this post being the last clause:

"and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

[onodera]

Originally posted by Deity Dude
Here's why:

First Amendment of the US Constitution:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

The pertinent part for this post being the last clause:

"and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

a) It says "the people".
b) It says "petition".
It doesn't say "companies" or "provide expensive gifts to".

[Deity Dude]

Companies and lobbying firms are a subset of "The People"

In fact, lobbying firms are hired by "The People" to petition the government in accordance with their 1st Amendment rights.

The word "petition" in this example simply means "to address" or "to communicate to"

Now I agree "Lobbyists" have too much influence, but until you can clearly defiine the difference between

A) a lobbyist (a group that represents Oil Companies let's say)

and

B) a "non-Lobbyists" (a group of citizens concerned with the education of young people, perhaps your local PTA)

and EVERYONE AGREES WITH YOU, I suggest you propose a Constitutional Amendment to override the 1st Amendment.

Just one thing to consider... If you own a permafrost wasteland in Alaska and there is an oil well underneath it, you don't mind someone going to Congress (i.e. petitoning the government) on your behalf, so that you can extract oil for a profit from your land. It might even be an oil company.

And if you are a parent in a school system that totally underperformes (like Detroit where under 25% of High School students graduate) you would get probably consider the PTA and Teacher's Union a "lobby" if/when they go to Congress and attempt to "petition" Congress so as not to allow Charter Scholls or Vouchers.

The point is anyone who contacts their Congressman is lobbying. Some are just more successful at it than others.

One man's "lobbyist" is another man's "advocate" or "representative"

[Ecthy]

Democracy 101 for onodera

[Elok]

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
I highly recommend the movie Thank You For Smoking . It's the best treatise on lobbying I've ever seen.

It is pretty freaking funny.

[Kidlicious]

Re: Why is lobbying even legal in the US?

So they can get more money. There's a simple answer for you.

[Deity Dude]

Who is "they" Kid?

Anyone who contacts their Representative is "lobbying".

Anyone who doesn't is "uninvolved"

Anyone who doesn't know who there Representative is either

a) Uninformed
b) Really Smart