Senate Overwhelmingly Pases Webb's GI Bill

[Patroklos]

. My issues with the McCain proposal are the significantly lower benefits and forcing more than one enlistment (at least 6 years) to get any benefits.

How is it lower? What it does is give the benefits to those who worked the hardest/longest for them. And you can still get your 40K upon your first enlistment, this is about the expansions of the GI Bill.

How does it work in a civilian firm? When do you get your raise? When do you get your benefits?

[snoopy369]

McCain's bill certainly offered a lower total level, Patroklos. I'm not sure where I stand on that; the specific level should be raised, whether it should be raised to the full cost of 4yr college and such I am not sure. One big question i'd have there is when you compare the GI bill to the College Loan payback program, you want the latter to be better (so there is an incentive to get a college education and then join the army, as opposed to the reverse - that way the army gets better trained soldiers in technical specialties and such rather than paying for the training itself).

In general, though, I think both bills had merit; and am very disappointed (but not surprised) that there was not more discussion about the benefits of both bills, and a compromise of some form. The bill was clearly intended to undercut McCain and to basically force all of the election-year republicans to support it, and the no-compromise attitude made that even more clear.

[Dinner]

The GI Bill has essentially become worthless over the last 50 years not just because no one bothered to modernize it but also because that scumbag Reagan cut it drastically. It seems some Republicans will give trillions to war profiteers with virtually no benefit to the service but almost never support the actual troops.

- When wounded Vets started coming back in droves from the mideast the Bush administration just dramatically increased the complexity of applying and receiving medical disability funds to discourage vets from receiving their rightful disability payments.

- The screwed up conditions at the VA were directly a result of cutting VA funding in the middle of a war. Congress had to step in before Bush stopped leaving our Vets in rat infested hell holes.

- When Congress recommended increasing pay for servicemen in order to deal with the recruitment & retention problems Bush ignored them.

- Now Congress wants to actually increase education opportunities for Vets by restoring the GI Bill essentially to the level of the it was before Reagan's cuts and Bush says he'll veto it.

These people volunteer for hard service risking death & dismemberment so the least we can do is pay them decent wages, make sure they receive high quality care if wounded, and to help these young people pay for college. That's not to much; that's just our basic responsibility as a nation.

[Dinner]

I used my GI Bill for college but it was only something like $385 per month. My grandfather used his GI Bill to go to college in 1946 and it was enough to pay for tuition, books, and rent. The proposed increase won't get us back to where the GI Bill used to be it will just restore it to the (inflation adjusted) level of the late 70's before Reagan took an axe to it.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Ramo
Absent some sort of fundamental change to the political process, that's how it always is going to be.

There really should be a rule against attaching unrelated measures to a bill.

If a measure (like this one) is popular enough to justify itself, it should be able to stand on its own. If not, it should be voted down on its own. There's really no reason to treatevery g d bill as if it were some sort of cheap christmas tree by hanging everything one could think of on it.

[Dinner]

I can think of many reasons why tying different items together in one bill is a good idea. Not least of which is it facilitates compromises so that both sides are assured they get legislation they feel is vital thus preventing total gridlock.

I'm sure you prefer it when government is gridlocked but most Americans want their government to function.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Arrian
I don't know what Obama said, but he's on dangerous ground if he's questioning McCain's support for veterans... that's an issue he shouldn't touch with a 10-foot pole. McCain has the better credentials on that issue. Leave it be.

Plus, I think the retention point is a good one.

-Arrian

Obama messed up by trying to slam McCain here. There is a difference of opinion, sure, but I think that both bills have merit. Webb's bill offers higher overall benefits and McCain's offers incentives for the longer amount of time you serve, promoting re-enlistment. Neither is being neglectful to US soldiers.