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Originally posted by Vanguard
the data in this editorial are highly questionable
the data in this editorial are highly questionable
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You may not know this, so I'll clue you in. An editorial is the opinion of the paper's editorial board. This article is not an editorial. It was clearly marked by me and the NY Times as an opinion piece.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891 -
Yes, I do know the difference. But I was trying to emphasize that this is not a news story. It is bull-****e.Originally posted by DanS
You may not know this, so I'll clue you in. An editorial is the opinion of the paper's editorial board. This article is not an editorial. It was clearly marked by me and the NY Times as an opinion piece.
Even the entire premise of this article's spin is fundamentally dumb. Obviously rich people spend less on consumption than poor people. That's what makes them "rich".
If they spent as much proportionally for food, housing and other things as everyone else, then they wouldn't be rich. Why, exactly, is the fact that each rich person consumes "only" ten times as much economic resources as each poor person supposed to be a good thing?Last edited by Vanguard; February 15, 2008, 13:38.VANGUARDComment
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Yea, the guy who wrote it is an economist and even writes for the Fed. That's worse than the WSJ writing it.Originally posted by DanS
You may not know this, so I'll clue you in. An editorial is the opinion of the paper's editorial board. This article is not an editorial. It was clearly marked by me and the NY Times as an opinion piece.I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett KavanaughComment
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Actually it does. People in the lowest quintile include retirees and landlords and other folks with passive income or who are spending down savings, selling off property, etc. The mistake here is to equate low regular income with poverty.Originally posted by Vanguard
In the first place, the data in this editorial are highly questionable. In particular the editorial doesn't clearly explain why the lowest income people can spend twice as much as the earn.
For example, I could own an apartment building. Any rent I collect is not taxed as income. So I could be bringing in lots of money, but statistically still be poor, as passive income isn't being counted on my income taxes. I might get hit with other taxes, but those aren't used to determine income levels. Of suppose I sold some stocks. I have to pay a capital gains tax, but not income tax, so again, this windfall of money isn't counted.
It is very definitely lying with statistics. So it is not a case of the poor getting richer.
The other way the article lies is by substituting absolute poverty for relative poverty. So because goods today are cheaper to make and much easier for realpoor people to buy, it is therefore equated that the poor are getting richer. Nothing of the sort is happening. They may have more stuff, but their position in society is still the same or worse. They are still taking home a smaller and smaller share of what society produces. Also, in absolute terms, they aren't doing so well either.
The real poor spend an ever greater proportion of their income on rent and food than they used to. Forty years ago, they spent 25% of their income on food. Ten years ago, it was around a third of their income on food. The price of housing has gone up considerable, and medical care has gone in to orbit. So while trinkets and gew gaws may be easier to afford, the necessities of life are not.Last edited by chequita guevara; February 15, 2008, 11:45.Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...Comment
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Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Any rent I collect is not taxed as income.
I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett KavanaughComment
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It may depend on the state, but rent is considered passive income, and not taxed by income tax. There are probably other taxes that apply, for example, in Florida there's an intangibles tax as well as property tax. At least that's how the seminar explained it.Originally posted by Kidicious
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...84/ai_18818239 says differently though.Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...Comment
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Snark is fun and all, but it helps if you have a leg to stand on. As it is you posted a pile of crapola as an "interesting opinion piece" about how the good times are a'rollin' for the poor. It was shredded in short order, and this is the best you can do?Originally posted by DanS
You may not know this, so I'll clue you in. An editorial is the opinion of the paper's editorial board. This article is not an editorial. It was clearly marked by me and the NY Times as an opinion piece.
-Arriangrog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!
The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.Comment
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Also, charity and government services for the poor might not be as good. For example, I had to get some food from the food bank a few weeks ago and the quality was very bad. The food didn't even go together, like I got taco shells with nothing else to make tacos with.I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett KavanaughComment
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I must have missed the part where it was "shredded in short order." On first pass, I didn't see any points that were worth responding to. But if you think there are particularly good points that I missed, then I'd be willing to respond to those.Originally posted by Arrian
Snark is fun and all, but it helps if you have a leg to stand on. As it is you posted a pile of crapola as an "interesting opinion piece" about how the good times are a'rollin' for the poor. It was shredded in short order, and this is the best you can do?I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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You DanSed me.
You just wasted six ... no, seven ... seconds of your life reading this sentence.Comment
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O.M.G.Also, charity and government services for the poor might not be as good. For example, I had to get some food from the food bank a few weeks ago and the quality was very bad. The food didn't even go together, like I got taco shells with nothing else to make tacos with."The DPRK is still in a state of war with the U.S. It's called a black out." - Che explaining why orbital nightime pictures of NK show few lights. Seriously.Comment
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That's a tax reduction strategy for high income people though. Most people count their rental income as active.Originally posted by chegitz guevara
It may depend on the state, but rent is considered passive income, and not taxed by income tax. There are probably other taxes that apply, for example, in Florida there's an intangibles tax as well as property tax. At least that's how the seminar explained it.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...84/ai_18818239 says differently though.I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett KavanaughComment
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There's only one poster in this thread who ever might be worth responding to, and he hasn't made a particularly strong challenge IMO.Originally posted by Arrian
Snark is fun and all, but it helps if you have a leg to stand on. As it is you posted a pile of crapola as an "interesting opinion piece" about how the good times are a'rollin' for the poor. It was shredded in short order, and this is the best you can do?
-ArrianComment
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yeah, that's pretty much what I took away from it too.Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Ahhh, the bottom quintile includes people who aren't really poor. So how does that prove the poor are doing fine?The undeserving maintain power by promoting hysteria.Comment
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College freshmen aren't allowed in ivory towers.Originally posted by Kuciwalker
There's only one poster in this thread who ever might be worth responding to, and he hasn't made a particularly strong challenge IMO.I drank beer. I like beer. I still like beer. ... Do you like beer Senator?
- Justice Brett KavanaughComment
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