This is not a torture memo

[Kidlicious]

"Tazering can be torture.

Tazering to decrease risk of injury (to officers and the suspect) in cases of physical confrontations is not torture.

There is a very real difference between a physical confrontation and "data extraction" from a suspect already in custody."

Are you taking this back now? Did you look at the other thread I bumped or something?

[Aeson]

Originally posted by Kidicious
I agreed completely with your statement. I'm the only one on this site who agrees with you. Doesn't that tell you anything?

(if that were true...)

What it tells me is I must be delusional if you're agreeing with me and everyone else is disagreeing.

(but...)

I'm sure we can find at least one person on the site to agree with me. Because I don't agree with you about how many people hold the views you say they hold.

[Aeson]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Are you taking this back now? Did you look at the other thread I bumped or something?

Why would I take it back?

[Darius871]

Originally posted by Aeson
OMG! I never would have guessed that anyone in Poly OT would say something disingenuous or misleading! Luckily for us we have Kid the wonder dog... able to tell us what we really think no matter what we say!

Originally posted by Aeson
I'm sure we can find at least one person on the site to agree with me.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Aeson


(if that were true...)

What it tells me is I must be delusional if you're agreeing with me and everyone else is disagreeing.

(but...)

I'm sure we can find at least one person on the site to agree with me. Because I don't agree with you about how many people hold the views you say they hold.

Whatever. That thread was on top for a long time. No one agreed with me then. People much more prone to reason than you and Darius.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Aeson


Why would I take it back?

Look at that thread. I bet you want to take it back. I bet you do. Cause you don't want to call police toturers.

[Aeson]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Whatever. That thread was on top for a long time. No one agreed with me then.

Ah. So we have to follow each and every inane discussion and always give our opinions on each point otherwise our positions on said point are whatever Kid wants to claim they are?



Keep em coming Kid!

People much more prone to reason than you and Darius.

This is just hillarious. The two people who "agree with you" (though I seriously doubt we actually do since you're misrepresenting your position no doubt) are the ones you think are less prone to reason.

From just that information, I'd have to say you're correct. Agreeing with you would call a person's reason into question just on general terms.

[Aeson]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Look at that thread. I bet you want to take it back. I bet you do. Cause you don't want to call police toturers.

I don't need to look at the thread, I remember the relevent portion of it quite well, including my own stance there. I've watched the videos. It wasn't torture.

(I'll leave it at that for now because I want to let you hang yourself on the, "Oh, but you're contradicting yourself" that's just eating away inside you. I'm saying this because I'm betting you won't be able to resist even though you know I want you to say it. And that will just make it even more hillarious.)

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Aeson
It wasn't torture.

I just knew it. That is all. Now response is required or desired.

You take the cake as the most irritating person on this site.

[Aeson]

Originally posted by Kidicious
I just knew it.

What amazing deductive prowess! I mean, I had already stated my views on that particular incident, in a discussion with a poster... who was it... I think his name was Kidicious... and magically, just a month later, you were able to deduce what my stance was on that particular situation!

That is all. Now response is required or desired.

Oh, you want the response. That's why you keep it going. If you want to say "I don't want to talk anymore" you do so by actually not posting responses to me. Just a little helpful hint.

You top the cake as the most irritating person on this site.

What did you think our conversation was about? That I was trying to be nice to you for your derogatory remarks?

[Blake]

Originally posted by Pekka
Well that's because it traditionally isn't.

Pain isn't the only measure when we are deciding what torture is.

Is getting kicked in the balls torture? Yes and no. If someone kicks you in the balls in the streets, it's not torture. If someone captures you, controls the environment and methodically comes in to kick you in the balls, it is torture.

Torture is methodical, it is a tool like thing that is guided by rational process. So the pain isn't the only measure, and torture has much more mental side to it than physical pain.

This is very obvious.

Indeed.

An interesting question is whether it is possible to torture a fully enlightened Buddhist Monk (or doesn't have to be Buddhist, just with the same mental prowess). Damage the body, yes, but the mind is in a place where it is safe from any harm. These are the guys who can set themselves on fire and self immolate without batting an eye. I've experienced a small measure of this, enough to know that the liberation from fear and suffering is a very real effect - it's not a matter of willpower, the fear and suffering just isn't there. If someone has enough* enlightenment it is not possible to make them suffer.

* Enough depends on the intensity of the suffering. Probably the most intense, is torturing loved ones or innocents. That's a good way to get through "Tough Guys" with a lot of willpower. But it DOESN'T work on "Wise Men", at least not in the same way... (the compassionate being will do everything in their power to save another from unnecessary suffering, but that's due to compassion not empathy (shared pain))

[Arrian]

Btw, a big to a serious, rational Pekka post. Those tend to be quite good.

Aeson v. Kid is pretty funny. Beaten like a rented mule doesn't even begin to cover it.

-Arrian

[Kidlicious]

I remember the thread where Ned denied torture. I'm thinking most people on this site are at that level.

[Arrian]

1. I haven't commented on whether or not the topic of this thread is torture. I long ago decided, however, that our lovely government had crossed the line into using what I consider torture on people. I'm disgusted by it.

/me skims the OP

Yeah, that's torture.

2. Tasering someone to restrain them during an arrest/detainment is not torture. A taser CAN be used as a torture device, but of course so can damned near anything. You were wrong when we had the tasering thread, and you're wrong now.

-Arrian

[Lorizael]

There are far worse things are government could be doing. There are far worse things are government is doing. But this is not a path I want our government going down.