My world view has drastically changed - I no longer root for the bull

[Thorgal]

Originally posted by East Street Trader
The first phase of the fight is the matador facing the bull when it is fresh and uninjured.

After a number of passes the matador withdraws and the picador weakens the bull's neck muscle in the way Sloww's picture illustrates. Then banderilleros further weaken the neck muscle by throwing darts into it.

Now the matador returns. He provokes a series of charges so that he can show off his cape work. He must induce the bull to pass as close to his body as he can.

Now comes the climax of the fight. The matador must dominate the bull so as to induce it to stand still, front legs square on and with its head hanging down. The matador now approaches the bull from the front and leans in over the horns to drive his sword down through the weakened muscle, between the bull's shoulder blades and into its heart.

If well done the bull drops as if pole axed.

Typically it takes the matador several attempts. He is aiming at a target only a couple of inches in diameter and, at the moment the coup de grace is administered, all the bull has to do to gore the matador is to lift its head.

A cocky matador confident in his dominance of the bull proceeds with a degree of deliberation. Mostly they run in hurriedly.

The weakening of the neck muscle by the picadors and banderilleros is necessary because otherwise the sword would not penetrate easily enough.

You can find a detailed description in Hemingway's Death in the Afternoon. Which is a good read generally.

Very well explained. However i am not sure about the objective of the picador and banderillas being to weak the neck muscle allowing the sword to penetrate, since the sword is sharpened as a shaving razor.
The objective is to tire the bull, specially his neck, forcing it to maintain his head a bit lower with less tendency to lift it, so the matador can thrown himself beetwen the horns and reach the critical point with less risk of being gored.

However in modern times, most bulls are so weak that sometimes the picador barely touch the bull´s neck, being the bull himself running and charging who gets tired quickly. In contrast with old times when bulls were much stronger and able to take many picas, killing dozens of horses in the process. Becuase 70-80 years ago picador´s horses were without armor, so several horses (which were old horses destinated to the slaughter house) were eviscerated in the bullring in every bullfighting. That would be areally good spectacle for any PETA member, wouldnt it?

[Shrapnel12]

Just because it's a fair fight or dangerous for the matador, doesn't make it right, many gladiator fights in Rome were fair. Just because it's cultural doesn't make it right, "martyrdom" is cultural. Just because something is less horrible then you thought, doesn't mean it's not still horrible. I'll leave this fight to PiTA (mispelled on purpose) however as I can think of a lot worse things.

[East Street Trader]

Thorgal, you will know far more than I about bull fighting and I gladly defer to you.

I attended one corrida - in Barcelona - in the sixties. The passage with the picadors was indeed the most difficult to take. The horses were old and wore a heavy quilting which made it more difficult for the bull to gore them. But the bulls could get their horns under the quilting so as to get at the horse and several were badly hurt.

I believe it is different with Portuguese bull fighting. But that I have not seen.

I found the early passage, when the bull is fresh, exhilarating. It was a shock when the bull first ran into the ring. They are (or were then, anyway) magnificent creatures - smaller than domestic bulls with longer horns, very sharp and intimidating. But the impressive thing about them was their energy, pride and ferocity.

In no way whatsoever would I go near one, let alone fight it with a cape.

Undoubtedly the whole thing is barbaric. But quite a spectacle. Impossible not to be impressed with the bravery of both bull and matador.

[Shrapnel12]

Speaking on the cruelty issue, if anyone thinks that what we do to animals for food and sport is cruel, you really should see what happens to them in their natural setting, not to justify what we do, but just to give you a perspective on what is cruel and what is not. I was watching a nature show, probably on Discovery, and a water buffalo had gotten stuck in a mud hole. A group of hyenas came across the buffalo and proceeded to eat the buffalo alive. Its cries were heartbreaking. I couldn't imagine the pain it was going through. The hyenas were not taking very large bites and the small wounds by themselves were not fatal to the bull, so only over a long time would the bull eventually die. Slaughtering cows for food and bullfighting sound incredibly merciful compared to this.

[Odin]

Gah, I thought this was going to be about the stock market.

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Shrapnel12
Speaking on the cruelty issue, if anyone thinks that what we do to animals for food and sport is cruel, you really should see what happens to them in their natural setting, not to justify what we do, but just to give you a perspective on what is cruel and what is not. I was watching a nature show, probably on Discovery, and a water buffalo had gotten stuck in a mud hole. A group of hyenas came across the buffalo and proceeded to eat the buffalo alive. Its cries were heartbreaking. I couldn't imagine the pain it was going through. The hyenas were not taking very large bites and the small wounds by themselves were not fatal to the bull, so only over a long time would the bull eventually die. Slaughtering cows for food and bullfighting sound incredibly merciful compared to this.

I heard that those hyenas only got charged with buffaloslaughter.