So do you think we'll strike back?

[Varwnos]

I do not think at all that in Europe there is such a view of terrorism. You appear to be projecting your own views, on an alien entity to you (Europe). If anything most european countries were entirely against the invasion of Iraq, and the rhetoric of a "war on terror".

[Rufus T. Firefly]

The OP posited a hypothetical, future Europe that felt differently. I've been addressing the hypothetical.

[Varwnos]

Yes, i was reacting to the OP myself
I do not think that there will be any such massive change in attitude. Up to now the only countries that have actually been targeted by international terrorism were the ones very actively involved in the invasion of Iraq (and they were very few)

[Blake]

Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly
In fact, it's not at all clear what you do understand.

I understand the power of the media (and by this I also mean advertising and a culture of consumerism in general) in getting people to kill themselves and to be generally indifferent to death. Part of this power is in distracting people with things which aren't actually all that important - generally creating an atmosphere of fear, where, in the minds of the sheeple, the major chronic problems of the social system are dwarfed by minor acute events which are heavily publicized - which have more emotional impact - which shock and awe.

What I'm saying, is that billions spent on curing social woes would go far, far, far further than billions spent on fighting a "war on terror" - which will actually have approximately zero effect because the actual risk was already so negligible in the grand scheme of things (but also because the military strategy was blatantly flawed from the start - no, killing the people who hate you does not result in less people who hate you - I know it's counter-intuitive, but those people have friends and families and countrymen who will hate you for killing them so it actually multiplies the hate and illwill).

America is a culture where decision making is often made on emotion rather than reason, and where there is much shameless emotional manipulation done. It is no doubt entirely coincidental that the "emotional decisions" often align with profit for those who are doing the manipulating.

[Patroklos]

America is a culture where decision making is often made on emotion rather than reason

Name me a Democracy that is different.

profit for those who are doing the manipulating

Nobody is being manipulated. People are making decisions that you don't like. People who are fat off of fast food are that way because they want to be. They chose to eat a Big Mack every day for lunch for 30 years. They probably also chose to not work out for those 30 years too.

Welcome to freedom Blake, which is not just doing what you want but dealing with the consequences of what you chose. People like you seem to have forgotten the personal accountability part.

If your too stupid/weak to resist the ad campaign of a company based 15000 miles away that is your problem. McDonalds is a food service company, nothing more. They are not out to kill you. You, however, might be out to kill yourself.

[Lancer]

Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly
Think visas. The 9/11 hijackers had visas. The London doctors had visas.

Right now visa security measures try to screen for terrorists, but it would be interesting to see what the result would be if Western nations decided they were no longer issuing visas to anybody from a country with an Islamic government. Let the pressure fall to the citizens of those countries, especially the ones who are innocent: no business trips, no shopping sprees, no Western education for your kids, nothing until you get your acts together and at least try to eradicate the cancer in your own society.

I really like this approach. We could even try this even before we nuke the cancer. I'm thinking of a kemo joke, but no...

[Lancer]

Originally posted by Blaupanzer
Nuking "terrorist supporting states" is rather like taking a hammer to a marshmallow. The mess is really bad, but the marshmallow is still there. Terrorism won't go away because we murdered a bunch of relatively innocent civilians in a part of the world that is very serious about long-term grudges(thousand years and more).

It's hard to hold a grudge when you're dead. I don't disagree that alot of innocents would get killed, but they, the terrorists and the states that support them, started that bit of nastyness.

[Lancer]

Well ok, who knows who started it, people have been killing innocents forever. However, if they nuke us we'll nuke them and sort it out later. Right or wrong, the surviving US citizenry who view a destroyed, irradiated american city will demand it.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Pekka
I won't bother posting here anymore .. . .

promise?

[One_more_turn]

We will strike back when they really hurt us.