What are you more afraid of? Your own government or "terrorists"?

[Vesayen]

I've thought about this a fair bit, but I've never really changed my view.

What are you more afraid, your own government, or "terrorists"?

I have always been more afraid of my own government. On September 12th I was more worried about the government trying to steal away civil liberties in the name of security, then the scene at the twin towers and I live within a short drive of them. Looks like I was right, between illegal surveillance, the patriot act and massive corruption of the executive(not as massive if Cheney is not in the executive, I suppose).

My government has the power to effect my life and the life of everyone in my country and the potential to submit us to tyranny. If we play an odds game, the odds are high that the government can succeed in an effort to negatively impact my life. Invasions of foreign countries which then justifies massive deficit spending can play havoc with the economy, it can also be used as an excuse for dealing with a whole host of domestic issues, which also, directly effect my life.

Now lets look at "terrorists". What is the likeliness that terrorists will negatively impact my life? Well its not particularly likely that any terrorists will kill me or anyone that I care about, there has not been any attempt on infrastructure targets in the U.S. like shipping, water processing plants, industrial warehouses, water reservoirs, or other targets which could cause serious calamity.

The odds of a terrorist negatively impacting my life is, quite low. The odds of the government negatively impacting my life is, quite high, and ongoing. I really am not worried about pissed off muslims trying to kill me but I am pretty worried about my own government.

[SlowwHand]

Leave.

[Heresson]

I am afraid of my gouverment. I would't be afraid of the gouverment if I lived somewhere else.

[Vesayen]

Why leave? This is a legitimate question.

[SlowwHand]

No, it's a stupid question.
You don't see people streaming into Iraq, Somalia, Ethiopia, Mexico, Ecua****ingdor, Russia. Not even France, as big a draw as that must be.
You don't see people fighting to get in anywhere, more than the USA.

You listen to MOBIUS too much.

[Cort Haus]

nm

[LordShiva]

Neither

[Vesayen]

Actually I don't listen to Mobius at all. I don't live anywhere near Somalia, Ethiopia which have been in a state of chaos for decades.

Ecuador is too distant to be a concern and too poor.

Russia has taken a firm stance about abusing civil rights to kill their own terrorists(and any civilians who happen to be in a movie theater with them) but to be honest, I would not call the chechans(sp?) "terrorists" in the same way most people think of most muslim extremists.

I don't recall any terrorists attacks in France, just a bunch of pissed off muslim youth rioting. This does not mean it can't happen, just that it has not, yet.

All of these places are distant and have no effect on me. Yet when "terrorists" are used as an exscuse to ignore important domestic issues, or steal my civil liberties, this does directly effect me.

[SlowwHand]

We have a woman at work that works in Receiving.
She's from Somalia, and has been here 9 years.
I overheard this jackass UPS guy asking her, "Do you ever go back to the motherland?".
I was on the side of the truck, out of sight. Not lurking, just smoking.
This woman says "Motherland? Why would I ever go visit Somalia? I'm out." Dumbass UPS driver. Hasn't a damned clue, and showed the woman what an ingrate he is.

[Vesayen]

Yes, it is pretty bad for the people in Somalia. Explain to me how this effects me, a fat happy American, at all, let alone more then my own government.

Meanwhile INCREDIBLE defecit spending is something I am going to have to pay for with my own tax dollars. In fact it effects me, even now. Bumbling and lack of attention to domestic policy has had the value of the USD go down a lot over the last few years, my money now has less buying power.

[SlowwHand]

I think you just provided excellent rebuttal to your opening post. I can do no better than you just did.

[Vesayen]

I fail to see how. Things suck in some other countries. This does not effect me in any meaningful way.

Meanwhile, how many hundreds of billions wasted on the war, or increased security in the country, which has not appeared to stop a single attack, would have otherwise gone to services I might use and enjoy?

[bipolarbear]

The U.S. is a good place to live, yet I still live in fear more of the government than terrorists. Not to say that there isn't a threat of terrorism, but I think that, especially in the light of the current administration, that the dangers posed by a corrupt government is greater than that of terrorism.

I think part of America's strength is in our system, and compromising that, imo, would be worse for the country than killing ~5000 people in skyscrapers. It's all based on speculation though.

[Patroklos]

which has not appeared to stop a single attack,

Really?

Proof!

[Dauphin]

I'm not afraid of either.