Iranian crackdown

[MOBIUS]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


No, its not.

But never mind. Im quite happy that you are continuing to bump this thread.

Che's USS Liberty is riddled with your use of this tactic, but let's not let your hypocrisy get in the way of fact shall we...

[DanS]

I'm interested in hearing about Ahmadinejad's economic policies that underly the malaise. The Beeb had an article on this a couple of days ago, but in typical Beeb web fashion, wasn't much of an article.

[MOBIUS]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


why would i want him to go away, he keeps bumping this thread. The more people who see whats going on, the better.

If anyone thinks the WaPo is unreliable (despite the article being by the normally antineocon Robin Wright) here is confirmation of part of it by the Beeb.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6761663.stm

You should have posted a poll:

What would you rather? Endure the Iranian crackdown, or spend 5.5 years and counting as a guest of hotel Gitmo?

[aneeshm]

Originally posted by MOBIUS
Don't you think that Guantanamo Bay is a far worse abuse of human rights than this?

Sure this is bad, but this is a walk in the park compared to what's happening there considering that up to 85% of the detainees are considered innocent people in the wrong place at the wrong time...

One of the latest stories in the UK.

Guantanamo inmate told: You can't return to UK, you've been away too long

You will note this guy wasn't even on the same continent as Afghanistan or Iraq when he was detained...

And you are lynching Negroes.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by MOBIUS


Che's USS Liberty is riddled with your use of this tactic, but let's not let your hypocrisy get in the way of fact shall we...

Id say that was comparison of mistakes in ship recognition in one era with those in another. Some folks including Plato attempted to clarify the differences, and I certainly didnt object to that.'

What we see in Iran is an oppressive regime that was losing popularity, and that nominated a populist leader to appease the masses. That populist has worsened the economic situation of the masses, both through his economic policies and his foreign policy, and with the rise of real popular opposition the regime (how united, would be a worthwhile topic of debate) is now cracking down harder, with unknown consequences.

Im sure someone as erudite as you can come up with some similar situation in western or pro-western country, and I invite you to do so.

[MOBIUS]

Originally posted by DanS
I'm interested in hearing about Ahmadinejad's economic policies that underly the malaise. The Beeb had an article on this a couple of days ago, but in typical Beeb web fashion, wasn't much of an article.

Well this is the whole thing in a nutshell...

Ahmedinejad needs to provoke the West because without us providing him with a focus for his support he would be in a lot of trouble domestically. It is literally a case of if we ignored him, he'd go away.

I mentioned this on poly a while back...

Reminds me of Thatcher's situation just before the Falklands. She would have lost the next election without the nationalistic fervour garnered from winning that war.

[aneeshm]

I think Islam may have to pass through its dark ages before their enlightenment happens. So I see this as good news. Only when the situation is so FUBAR that even the common man can see it will Islam reform.

Some horses obey without question.
Some horses obey when they see the shadow of the whip.
Some horses obey when they hear the whip being cracked.
And finally, some horses obey only when brutally lashed.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by MOBIUS


You should have posted a poll:

What would you rather? Endure the Iranian crackdown, or spend 5.5 years and counting as a guest of hotel Gitmo?

Total of a few hundred people out of the entire resident populations of Afghanistan and Pakistan circa 2001 who ever managed to see Cubas sunny shores.

How many folks in Iran are impacted. Lets see.

All the university students. All the labor activists. Women, including those of no political bent. Via the economy, almost everyone in Iran.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by MOBIUS


Well this is the whole thing in a nutshell...

Ahmedinejad needs to provoke the West because without us providing him with a focus for his support he would be in a lot of trouble domestically. It is literally a case of if we ignored him, he'd go away.

But he doesnt seem to have managed to fine tune it very well. His isolation of Iran is FEEDING discontent, and while sanctions thus far have been mainly symbolic, theyve stirred up anxieties that have had real impacts on the Iranian economy. If hes already this desperate, what will he do if and when more effective sanctions are put in place?

[MOBIUS]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


Id say that was comparison of mistakes in ship recognition in one era with those in another. Some folks including Plato attempted to clarify the differences, and I certainly didnt object to that.'

It was more than that, and you know it simply by the fact that you felt you had to answer me.

What we see in Iran is an oppressive regime that was losing popularity, and that nominated a populist leader to appease the masses. That populist has worsened the economic situation of the masses, both through his economic policies and his foreign policy, and with the rise of real popular opposition the regime (how united, would be a worthwhile topic of debate) is now cracking down harder, with unknown consequences.

Im sure someone as erudite as you can come up with some similar situation in western or pro-western country, and I invite you to do so.

Zimbabwe is a close enough example.

[MOBIUS]

Originally posted by lord of the mark

Total of a few hundred people out of the entire resident populations of Afghanistan and Pakistan circa 2001 who ever managed to see Cubas sunny shores.

How many folks in Iran are impacted. Lets see.

All the university students. All the labor activists. Women, including those of no political bent. Via the economy, almost everyone in Iran.

It isn't just those countries. My example had no connection whatsoever with either of those countries - he wasn't even on the same continent.

The number is frankly irrelevant anyway. Which reality would YOU choose LotM?

[MOBIUS]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


But he doesnt seem to have managed to fine tune it very well. His isolation of Iran is FEEDING discontent, and while sanctions thus far have been mainly symbolic, theyve stirred up anxieties that have had real impacts on the Iranian economy. If hes already this desperate, what will he do if and when more effective sanctions are put in place?

Well that is the problem about backing a wounded beast into a corner, isn't it? Which is exactly what the West is doing...

You'd have thought after Afghanistan, Iraq, Gitmo... We'd have learned to stop making stupid mistakes...

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by MOBIUS


It was more than that, and you know it simply by the fact that you felt you had to answer me.



Zimbabwe is a close enough example.

Zimbabwe is pro-western?

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
why would i want him to go away, he keeps bumping this thread.

Crapping all over it you mean? Or possibly chasing away meaningful discussion?

[PLATO]

Originally posted by MOBIUS


Well that is the problem about backing a wounded beast into a corner, isn't it? Which is exactly what the West is doing...

You'd have thought after Afghanistan, Iraq, Gitmo... We'd have learned to stop making stupid mistakes...

Yes...Al Qeada and Sadaam were good ole boys. We sure messed up by not liking them fellows. We sure should of let them nice terrorist boys go home to their mommas too. Just don't know what we was thinkin with Gitmo.

Now, 'bout this here Eye-Rain-an fellow...I reckon we should help this ole boy build his new clear weapon so he can get rid of them truble makin Jews anyway.

*****

Hmmm...your right! It isn't so hard to think like an idiot!