Two Palestinian States?

[Az]

Oh cmon, they will still be running the WB, will likely get the funds that had previously been promised to the "PA". If they use probably ineffective CW on Gaza, they would alienate the entire arab-muslim world, and make themselves unsupportable by Israel, the US, etc. It would be suicide.

Has any reputable source in Israel suggested that they would do this?

It's a purely theoretical discussion.


A very interesting situation is occurring with the Palestinians. I can even see a good part about it: It's very cathartic. It's the manure hitting the proverbial fan - in the best meaning of it all. We're going to see some serious changes in this stalemate. What I am most interested in is the amount of involvement from Syria and Iran.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Oerdin
No one has said they'd do this though if they had the balls to do it I'd say the US would do exactly what it has done in the past. Namely, look the other way. If Fatah framed this as the evil Islamic terrorist organization of Hamas was going to take over all of Palestine unless we did this then the US would do exactly what they did when Saddam used chemical weapons... Rationalize it away by saying Fatah is less of an evil then Hamas is (before it was Saddam is less of an evil then Iran is). Saddam gassed thousands and Reagan made sure the guy got any weapons he wanted. Sure, Reagan was a piece of dog **** but I have every expectation that future American presidents will be in the Bush/Reagan mold of immoral pieces of dog **** who would stab their own mothers in the name of real politick. It's rare to get someone like Clinton who actually stands up against state terrorist acts when they don't have to.

Oh so this was just your usual concern with US politics?

1. In fact we are much more involved, and more openly involved with Fatah than we were with Saddam. While our help (mainly some intell, and the reflagging of tankers, which latter was theoretically aid to the Gulf states not to Iraq) was helpful to Iraq, Saddam was clearly a soveriegn running a state that could get along without us. Fatah is not.

2. Saddam was using CW on his own recognized sove territory. The PA is NOT soveriegn anywhere, and cant hide behind Westphalian rights. Assuming the world even decided to recognize any Fatah regime in the WB as "the" PA.

3. The focus the US has placed on WMD, including CW, since 1991, has changed the place of CW in world affairs.

4. Saddam could deliver CW effectively in Kurdistan, using air power and artillery. Fatah would have to use undercover delivery, which would not only be ineffective, but would look exactly like the nightmare scenario weve been worried about since the mid 90s, and esp since 2001.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Az

Oh cmon, they will still be running the WB, will likely get the funds that had previously been promised to the "PA". If they use probably ineffective CW on Gaza, they would alienate the entire arab-muslim world, and make themselves unsupportable by Israel, the US, etc. It would be suicide.

Has any reputable source in Israel suggested that they would do this?

It's a purely theoretical discussion.


A very interesting situation is occurring with the Palestinians. I can even see a good part about it: It's very cathartic. It's the manure hitting the proverbial fan - in the best meaning of it all. We're going to see some serious changes in this stalemate. What I am most interested in is the amount of involvement from Syria and Iran.

'To be quite honest, the only reason I don't think that Fatah will use chemical weapons on Hamas '

doesnt sound theoretical to me.


BTW, mazal tov on the new leadership of Avodah.

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


If youre not going to call it the West Bank, why not just say Yesha, who other than the Israelis and me do you think will recognize "J&S"?

I don't rec'nize it, but I'm willing to bet it means "Judaea and Samaria".

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Last Conformist

I don't rec'nize it, but I'm willing to bet it means "Judaea and Samaria".

A free bottle of Sabra liquer to this man!

[lord of the mark]

flash

Abbas has just announced that he is dissolving the PA govt, and will form a new one with an independent pol replacing Hanniyeh. He has declared a state of emergency and will rule by decree.

[Ramo]

BTW, mazal tov on the new leadership of Avodah.

Is there a realistic chance that Barak'll beat Bibi?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Ramo


Is there a realistic chance that Barak'll beat Bibi?

the polls showing Bibi way ahead all had Peretz and Olmert as his opponents, IIUC. Olmert will likely be gone soon too (Maybe replaced by Lipni)

Things are quite fluid, IIUC, while the current events in Gaza would appear to favor Bibi, things could look different in a week.

And of course if Bibi is still ahead in the polls, Barak and the head of Kadima will probably try to hold off on new elections.

what say you, Az?

[Az]

Barak and Bibi are head to head in polls, but that can be explained by all the fuss in the news about the primary elections in Avodah.

The only thing that matters is will Barak be able to consolidate all camps in Avodah into a fighting force, while coming up with a solid platform in the uneasy challenges that obviously are surrounding us, or, even better for him and the entire country, convince the public that he knows what he's doing without divulging his plans ( thus letting our foes prepare accordingly ).

To sum up, the public sure is up for a "Daddy knows best" kind of Sharonesque leadership. Currently, I think it can work, as long as he's not as corrupt as Sharon.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Az
Currently, I think it can work, as long as he's not as corrupt as Sharon.

Would it be correct to say that Labour doesnt have the tradition of "princelings" that Likud has? The tendency of sons (and daughters) of pols to get deeply involved in party politics? (Yael Dayan aside)

[Az]

Yuli Tamir is a relative of Rabin. I don't remember how close a relative she is. ( After all, I am a relative of Rabin, too. )

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
If youre not going to call it the West Bank, why not just say Yesha, who other than the Israelis and me do you think will recognize "J&S"?

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by Oerdin
I'm just saying it is extremely easy to make chemical weapons and if you have the balls to do so then you can quickly kill off most of the opposition.

Call me old-fashioned, but isn't that illegal?

Sorry! The administrator has specified that users can only post one message every 30 seconds.

[Whoha]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Saddam gassed thousands and Reagan made sure the guy got any weapons he wanted.

Damn Reagan for sending Saddam Soviet, French, and Chinese weaponry! Why didn't he buy American, that bastard!

It's rare to get someone like Clinton who actually stands up against state terrorist acts when they don't have to.

Are you talking about Kosovo,?

[Drake Tungsten]

Originally posted by Cort Haus

Originally posted by lord of the mark
If youre not going to call it the West Bank, why not just say Yesha, who other than the Israelis and me do you think will recognize "J&S"?

Yeah, I recognized it as well. Apparently LOTM thinks all gentiles are morons...