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The Catholic Church Takes Another Bold Stand on a Vital Issue

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  • The Catholic Church Takes Another Bold Stand on a Vital Issue

    The End of Limbo
    What happens to all the babies who used to be there?
    By Michelle Tsai
    Posted Monday, April 23, 2007, at 6:59 PM ET

    The Vatican announced on Friday the results of a papal investigation of the concept of limbo. Church doctrine now states that unbaptized babies can go to Heaven instead of getting stuck somewhere between heaven and hell. If limbo doesn't exist, what happened to everyone who was supposed to have been there already?

    They've probably been in heaven all this time, but no one knows for sure. Until the recent announcement, the limbo crowd was thought to include anyone who hadn't been baptized but would otherwise deserve to go to heaven—like infants (including aborted fetuses), virtuous pagans, and pre-Christian Jews. Those who had been baptized, on the other hand, either joined God in heaven, made up for their sins in purgatory, or suffered forever in hell.

    If limbo never existed in the first place, you might assume that these souls passed straight through St. Peter's gates. But the carefully worded document from the Vatican's International Theological Commission stops short of certainty in this regard, arguing only that there are "serious theological and liturgical grounds for hope," rather than "sure knowledge."

    The fate of unbaptized babies has confounded Catholic scholars for centuries. According to church catechisms, or teachings, babies that haven't been splashed with holy water bear the original sin, which makes them ineligible for joining God in heaven. At the same time, as innocent beings, they surely don't deserve eternal torment. St. Augustine concluded in the fourth century that the babies must be punished in the fire of hell, but only with the "mildest condemnation." Eight centuries later, Thomas Aquinas thought infant souls wouldn't go to heaven, but they wouldn't suffer in the afterlife, either (and they wouldn't even know what they were missing). Theologians eventually settled on limbo as a hypothetical compromise—a state of natural, though incomplete, happiness.

    Dante depicted limbo in his Divine Comedy as a pastoral setting of forests with green meadows, flowing streams, and tall castles. Biblical figures like Noah and Moses live in Dante's limbo, as do Ovid, Homer, Aristotle, a parade of characters from Greco-Roman mythology, and even some Muslims, like Saladin, who managed to fight the crusaders and gain their respect at the same time.

    Though the Vatican has effectively done an about-face, it won't directly state that limbo never existed. Instead, it says that official church dogma never included the concept and that limbo remains a "possible theological hypothesis." Why the hemming and hawing? The church can't admit to going against hundreds of years of theological interpretation. Such a reversal would be a sign of error. And since the Roman Catholic Church is imbued with the Holy Spirit, it can never be wrong.

    But the church has indeed changed its opinion on several matters. From the 13th century to the 16th century, the church went from opposing usury—the custom of charging interest on a loan—to accepting it. Theologians also debated the legitimacy of slavery for years before Pope Leo XIII condemned the practice in 1888. That same pope also declared that Protestants were in error and could not be granted religious freedom, a doctrine that wouldn't be reversed until the Second Ecumenical Council of the Vatican in the 1960s.

    Bonus Explainer: Do Protestants have limbo? No. Presbyterian, Baptist, and German and Dutch reform traditions believe in predestination: A person who dies goes immediately to heaven or hell even if he or she was never baptized. On the other hand, some Lutherans, Anglicans, Episcopalians, and orthodox Christians hold that everybody remains in an "intermediate state" until the return of Jesus Christ on judgment day.
    The Vatican announced on Friday the results of a papal investigation of the concept of limbo. Church doctrine now states that unbaptized babies can go...


    Finally! Now the Buddha can accuse Jesus of plagiarism face-to-face.

    Still: first the office of Devil's Advocate, now Limbo; the Church is never going to win back its old followers if it keeps abolishing all the cool stuff.
    "I have as much authority as the pope. I just don't have as many people who believe it." — George Carlin

  • #2
    I like limboing.

    Limboing = boil Ming.
    www.my-piano.blogspot

    Comment


    • #3


      Copy cat.
      I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
      For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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      • #4
        Bah! That got threadjacked in 3 posts, and soon after. And it didn't have my OP's nifty explanation of Limbo.
        "I have as much authority as the pope. I just don't have as many people who believe it." — George Carlin

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        • #5
          Burn the heretics!
          "post reported"Winston, on the barricades for freedom of speech
          "I don't like laws all over the world. Doesn't mean I am going to do anything but post about it."Jon Miller

          Comment


          • #6
            ban Rufus
            "I realise I hold the key to freedom,
            I cannot let my life be ruled by threads" The Web Frogs
            Middle East!

            Comment


            • #7
              ...to limbo!
              The cake is NOT a lie. It's so delicious and moist.

              The Weighted Companion Cube is cheating on you, that slut.

              Comment


              • #8
                The cake is NOT a lie. It's so delicious and moist.

                The Weighted Companion Cube is cheating on you, that slut.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by DRoseDARs
                  ...to limbo!
                  I'm way too old, and I have a touchy back...
                  "I have as much authority as the pope. I just don't have as many people who believe it." — George Carlin

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DRoseDARs
                    if that's a limbo, the audience of it must be hell.
                    "I realise I hold the key to freedom,
                    I cannot let my life be ruled by threads" The Web Frogs
                    Middle East!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Doddler
                      I like limboing.

                      Limboing = boil Ming.
                      THEY!!111 OMG WTF LOL LET DA NOMADS AND TEH S3D3NTARY PEOPLA BOTH MAEK BITER AXP3REINCES
                      AND TEH GRAAT SINS OF THERE [DOCTRINAL] INOVATIONS BQU3ATH3D SMAL
                      AND!!1!11!!! LOL JUST IN CAES A DISPUTANT CALS U 2 DISPUT3 ABOUT THEYRE CLAMES
                      DO NOT THAN DISPUT3 ON THEM 3XCAPT BY WAY OF AN 3XTARNAL DISPUTA!!!!11!! WTF

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        limbo is the punishment Jews suffer today.

                        It is inflicted at Bar/Bat Mitzvah parties, and is accompanied by "Do the Limbo rock". The minor sinners only have to listen to the song for the thousandth time, while the major sinners are required to hold a limbo pole.
                        "A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Man, those protestants are sickos. Sending babies to hell.
                          “As a lifelong member of the Columbia Business School community, I adhere to the principles of truth, integrity, and respect. I will not lie, cheat, steal, or tolerate those who do.”
                          "Capitalism ho!"

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                          • #14
                            reminds me of that movie Dogma

                            why doesn't the Church understand that Jesus wasn't a fan of all these rules and legalisms? His message was brief and simple... The notion a baby (or anyone else) is going to hell because some priest didn't splash water on their face is

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