Iran playing games

[Drake Tungsten]

A question for serious posters: has a House Speaker ever visited the head of state of a country that the US has suspended diplomatic contacts with? Would be interesting to know the answer, but it's not really the sort of thing you can find on Google...

[Ramo]

I'm not serious. I feel so wounded.

Google is pretty useful if you have a specific set of people in mind:

This confronted me with a moral dilemma. At the urging of the
administration, I had joined in the bipartisan call for peace. Overjoyed
at the initial success of our efforts, I had met, at the White House's
request, with leaders of the Contra directorate. Most of them, I saw,
had faith in the peace effort. I also met with the Sandinista leaders
whenever they came to my office. I was convinced that most Nicaraguans
on both sides were eager for peace. But some bitterness lingered.
Someone, aside from me, had to be a go-between, an honest broker who
could bring the two sides together. Ideally, a Nicaraguan.

The only Nicaraguan fully trusted by both factions, I had learned
from trips I'd taken to the region, was Catholic Cardinal Miguel Obando
y Bravo. Responsible people in both camps agreed that he was the one to
monitor the cease-fire and help arbitrate the differences. As Speaker
and co-author of the call for peace, I met with the cardinal, whom I
knew personally, at the papal nuncio's office in Washington, on November
13, 1987, and encouraged him to undertake that critical role. He agreed,
and Nicaraguan President Daniel Ortega, at my personal urging, agreed to
give the cardinal a free hand.

The White House, bitterly resentful of my efforts in helping to keep
the peace process on track, began attacking me angrily in the press. The
President and Assistant Secretary of State Elliott Abrams considered my
endeavors intrusive and presumptuous. Perhaps they were. But having
committed myself in good faith to the effort to make peace, I was
unwilling to be a party to its deliberate unraveling or allow that
result if I could prevent it. Too many lives already had been lost. As a
percentage of Central America's population, their war dead would equate
to something like 5 million Americans--more than we have lost in all of
our wars combined.
On two occasions--in December 1987 and February 1988--the
President's forces tried to forsake the peace process altogether and
revive the war by renewing military aid for the Contras. On both
occasions, a majority in Congress voted down the request. At my personal
urging, Congress did appropriate funds for humanitarian assistance--
food, clothing, shelter and medical needs--for the Contra forces during
the cease-fire.

As a consequence of my unwillingness to abandon the effort I had
helped set in motion, I became a target for many personal attacks, both
in the conservative press and from some of my Republican colleagues in
Congress. It is ironic that, in bringing peace to Central America, I
unconsciously drove a wedge between myself and the congressional
minority, which ultimately inhibited my capacity to promote consensus on
other issues.

In retrospect, I firmly believe I did the right thing. We ended the
war and brought democracy to the region. One of the unavoidable
challenges of the speakership is determining when the end result is
worth risking one's own popularity, perhaps even one's moral authority,
with a segment of the membership. I do regret my inability to make peace
between Democrats and Republicans over this issue. Perhaps a more
cautious, more sensitive, more understanding person could have done
that.

-Jim Wright

http://www.gpoaccess.gov/serialset/cdocuments/hd108-204/text/wright.html

There probably are other examples...

Edit: A more specific link:

(Studio: Dan Rather) Report introduced.

(DC: Juan Vasquez) Nicaraguan president Dan. Ortega and long-time critic Cardinal Miguel Obando y Bravo shown shaking hands in DC. Representative Jim Wright also shown and mentioned as having met with Ortega and Obando. Ortega's plan for Nicaraguan cease-fire noted. [ORTEGA - (thru translator) says the US should trust Nicaragua because of this proposal for peace.] Ortega's proposal graphically illustrated. United States government's caution noted. [State Department spokesperson Charles REDMAN - says the Reagan administration will talk in a regional setting if peace proposal is in earnest.] Arms negotiator Paul Warnke shown at mtg. with Ortega, Obando and Wright. [OBANDO y Bravo - (thru translator) says he is participating in meeting because he wants peace.] Ortega shown visiting Vietnam War Memorial. Contra leaders asserting they want to meet only in Central American because it is a Central American war mentioned.

(DC: Terence Smith) President Reagan said not expected to comment on Sandinista proposal. White House aides not approving of Representative Jim Wright's involvement in meeting noted. White House spokesperson Marlin Fitzwater's comment regarding Wright's actions quoted on screen. [Secretary of State George SHULTZ - says the time is not right for direct talks with Nicaragua.] [State. Department spokesperson Charles REDMAN - says Jim Wright's actions are unknown.] Wright's failure to inform Shultz that he was planning to meet with Ortega and mediator discussed. [WRIGHT - says when he told Shultz later of his plans to meet with Ortega and the mediator he was not disapproving.] [Senator John McCAIN - says Wright is showing more attention to the Sandinistas than to the Contras. Democrats criticism of Reagan administration's handling of situation noted. [Senator Christopher DODD - defends Wright.] White House official's comment about how United States should not be in the midst of these talks quoted.

(Studio: Dan Rather) [Representative Jim WRIGHT - asserts that he was asked by Nicaraguan president Ortega to help with peace plans; mentions White House officials' criticism of himself and President Reagan's lack of criticism; notes Democrat colleague's disapproval of his actions.]

[Kuciwalker]

.

[Drake Tungsten]

I also met with the Sandinista leaders whenever they came to my office.

If Assad wants to fly to Washington and visit Pelosi in her office, I've got no problem with it...

[Ramo]

Exactly why can she meet him in DC, but not Damascus?

[Drake Tungsten]

Because he looks like a ***** if he visits her in Washington...

[Ramo]

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,966019,00.html

Here's an interesting article of the event. Good example of a leader of Congress doing something good in the face of opposition from asshats in the White House.

Anyways, Wright's role here is much, much bigger than anything Pelosi might've done in Damascus...

[Ramo]

Because he's the ***** if he visits her in Washington...

And the corollary is supposed to be that she's the ***** if she visits in Damascus? Why?

As I said, beliefs such as this from Dear Leader are basically why we're ****ed wrt our foreign policy.

[Drake Tungsten]

anything Pelosi might've done in Damascus...

Pelosi hasn't even gone to Damascus yet. Nice to see you have a keen grasp of the facts...

[Ramo]

I skimmed and misread the article since the relevant event's so inconsequential.

[Drake Tungsten]

[DanS]

Originally posted by Patroklos
The straights are narrow, and are bristling with missiles, but even with this I wouldn't bet on Iran being able to close the straits for anything more than a couple days, and that is just because we probably wouldn't have the balls to take even the slightest risk of losing a ship these days. We know where all those missile sites are, so a few days of laser guided bombs and cruise missiles and your good to go. They haven't had a successful C802/3 (the bulk of their costal arsenal) in the better part of a decade, and they try every year.

As far as their Navy, most would be destroyed peirside in hours, or soon after. If their Kilos got underway in time they could cause some trouble, but what is one or two tankers relative to shutting down the world economy? Kilos are ify though, my ship alone found two of them steaming home on the surface WAY out in the Gulf of Oman, presumably due to mechanical problems. They had some Houdongs run out to escort it eventually but we were there hours before (on accident both times, a surfaces submarine looks like any old sufficed contact on the top until the sun comes up) and could have taken it out with 50 cals let alone torps/missiles/5 inch.

The IRCGN has a lot of small speed boats/jet skis armed to various degrees to try overwhelm a transiting vessel, but there are a few basic tactics to screw that up, and with my ship having 8 .50s, 4 M60s, 2 automatic 40mm grenade launchers, 2 25mm chain guns, and various other small arms the chances of them getting to us is slight. And of course, we now have KEAT rounds for the 5 inch, and these are nasty for small boats.

So basically the only chance Iran has of taking out a warship is if they happen to have one transiting the straights when war breaks out, and they suprise it at that. I bet the oil companies would stop their tankers from transiting no matter how much damage we inflict on their coastal missile batteries for insurance reasons.

So the straits would be closed due to insurance.

Must say that I'm underwhelmed by this result.

[DanS]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

I also met with the Sandinista leaders whenever they came to my office.

If Assad wants to fly to Washington and visit Pelosi in her office, I've got no problem with it...

I don't know why this is anything to worry about. If Pelosi wishes to stick her foot in it by getting all chummy with Assad then far be it from the president to stop her...

[Drake Tungsten]

You actually think she's going to get called on this?

[DanS]

I doubt the Jewish lobby is happy to see her with Assad.