Brits - Channel 4 9pm Tonight "The Great Global Warming Swindle"

[Solly]

Should be fascinating viewing...

[Zkribbler]

...brought to you by Exxon Mobile.

[reds4ever]

It'll be interesting to hear the other side for once. All we get is the doom mongers telling us how evil we are.

[Solly]

Originally posted by Zkribbler
...brought to you by Exxon Mobile.

Yeah. Only took them ten years of the alarmist claptrap.

[Geronimo]

I'm a bit tired of the debate about whether global warming is a real phenomena.

I'd be more interested to hear debate on whether the negative long term consequences would really outweigh the positive long term consequences and the related issue of how the climate would likely behave in the absence of anthropogenic factors. Would we really be better off stopping global warming?

[Dinner]

That's actually the official line the wingnuts have switched to now. Back in 2000 they denied that global warming existed at all but now science has conclusively shown that 1) Global warming is real and 2) humans are the main cause of it. Thus the wingnuts have switched to a new line; namely "OK, I guess global warming is real but... IT'S REALLY A GOOD THING!!!"

It's just more lies for the same people who have been lying since the start. They just delay and delay and delay even though they know they're wrong. The science is already in and the concensus is that human caused climate change is going to lead to increased desertification in the sub-tropics, higher sea levels, and large scale disruptions to the lives of people, animals, and economies. The short anwser, as the scientists agreed at the UN's recent conference on climate change, is that global warming is very, very, very bad.

[Cort Haus]

"wingnuts"

Typical ad-hominem attacks.

[Cort Haus]

So according to Green Orthodoxy the co-founder of Greenpeace is a 'wingnut' for being alarmed at the misanthropy of the green movement today which regards "human beings as scum".

[Dinner]

Wingnuts = right wing nutjobs. It is simply truth in advertising to call them that.

[Provost Harrison]

Originally posted by reds4ever
It'll be interesting to hear the other side for once. All we get is the doom mongers telling us how evil we are.

QFT I am glad I am not the only one getting that feeling.

[Thedrin]

Very interesting viewing.

While I'm not familiar with the actual science it put forward (and thus can't back it up or trash it) it didn't raise any questions it didn't answer.

[Thedrin]

Oh, and the 'money from the oil companies' section was amusing.

The correlation between the rise of the global warming movement and the decline of the Soviet Union was intriguing as well.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Cort Haus
So according to Green Orthodoxy the co-founder of Greenpeace is a 'wingnut' for being alarmed at the misanthropy of the green movement today which regards "human beings as scum".

I can't speak for "Green Orthodoxy" since I'm not in any green movement. I can say with complete confidence that Green Peace is full of anti-science loonies though. It's a terrible organization who's ideological zeal against nuclear power almost assures that we won't be able to enough nongreen house gas causing power planets to meet Kyoto targets much less new targets. I wouldn't say Green Peace speaks for the average environmentally minded person any more then PETA speaks for people who like animals.

BTW the term wingnut specifically deals only with right wing loons so even though Green Peace is full of loons they would not be wingnuts. Capice?

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by Oerdin
That's actually the official line the wingnuts have switched to now. Back in 2000 they denied that global warming existed at all but now science has conclusively shown that 1) Global warming is real and 2) humans are the main cause of it. Thus the wingnuts have switched to a new line; namely "OK, I guess global warming is real but... IT'S REALLY A GOOD THING!!!"

It's just more lies for the same people who have been lying since the start. They just delay and delay and delay even though they know they're wrong. The science is already in and the concensus is that human caused climate change is going to lead to increased desertification in the sub-tropics, higher sea levels, and large scale disruptions to the lives of people, animals, and economies. The short anwser, as the scientists agreed at the UN's recent conference on climate change, is that global warming is very, very, very bad.

All worst case assumptions.

Furthermore, with respect to desertification, global precipitation will increase with a global increase in temperature. That is as basic and sound an assumption as that increased atmospheric CO2 leads to higher global temperatures.

You are also failing to address our current inability to predict global climate in the absence of anthropogenic factors and how those other unknown drivers of climate variability will respond to the anthropogenic factors.

I'm not a wingnut saying global warming is of no concern. I just want governments to spend enormous amounts of money on climate research so that we make informed policy decisions. Certainly the potential costs of inaction on global warming or of unnecessary austerity measures intended to prevent it both vastly dwarf by several orders of magnitude current spending on climate research.

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by Oerdin


I can't speak for "Green Orthodoxy" since I'm not in any green movement. I can say with complete confidence that Green Peace is full of anti-science loonies though. It's a terrible organization who's ideological zeal against nuclear power almost assures that we won't be able to enough nongreen house gas causing power planets to meet Kyoto targets much less new targets. I wouldn't say Green Peace speaks for the average environmentally minded person any more then PETA speaks for people who like animals.

BTW the term wingnut specifically deals only with right wing loons so even though Green Peace is full of loons they would not be wingnuts. Capice?

nuclear power.

Green Peace