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  • #1

    Israeli settlers

    Opening an own thread because I don't want to threadjack another one.

    Originally posted by lord of the mark
    What I dont much like is the attitude expressed here that settlers as a group are less than human, that violence against them is excusable, that their very existence is such an act of aggression that concern for the safety and sympathy at their plight, is a sign of incipient fascism.
    Just curious: who here claimed that settlers are subhumans?
    Either we have some really serious dickhead among us who is best to be put on ignore or you're malinterpreting things.


    One really serious question: How are the "legal" titles of the settling plots handled? Who claims to possess the land in the first place, who gives them out?
    Prove me wrong, but I doubt that the Palestine communes nearby the settlements have a say in the process... I also doubt that many Palestinians are selling their land to Israeli settlers.
    The whole settlement policy is outright land robbing, wild west style. Palestinians are being treated just like Americans treated Indians.
    For my part, I would resist the land robbing and do fight to expel those who unjustly take what is not theirs.

    It would be so easy to be on Israel's side, but the ongoing theft of Palestinian lands makes it impossible for me.
    "The world is too small in Vorarlberg". Austrian ex-vice-chancellor Hubert Gorbach in a letter to Alistar [sic] Darling, looking for a job...
    "Let me break this down for you, fresh from algebra II. A 95% chance to win 5 times means a (95*5) chance to win = 475% chance to win." Wiglaf, Court jester or hayseed, you judge.
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  • #2
    They are not less than human, but they certainly exhibit some of the worst traits of humanity being the scum they are...

    If someone blatantly stole my land in the manner that they have done, then if I lost hope that I would receive justice for that loss, then I too would resist!
    Is it me, or is MOBIUS a horrible person?

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    • #3
      Israel & Palestine obviously haven't upgraded to Civ4 yet
      THEY!!111 OMG WTF LOL LET DA NOMADS AND TEH S3D3NTARY PEOPLA BOTH MAEK BITER AXP3REINCES
      AND TEH GRAAT SINS OF THERE [DOCTRINAL] INOVATIONS BQU3ATH3D SMAL
      AND!!1!11!!! LOL JUST IN CAES A DISPUTANT CALS U 2 DISPUT3 ABOUT THEYRE CLAMES
      DO NOT THAN DISPUT3 ON THEM 3XCAPT BY WAY OF AN 3XTARNAL DISPUTA!!!!11!! WTF

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      • #4
        perhaps everyone who "stole" other peoples lands should give it back.

        when are The Europeans and Americans going to move out .
        GM of MAFIA #40 ,#41, #43, #45,#47,#49-#51,#53-#58,#61,#68,#70, #71

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        • #5
          That's rich coming from an Aussie!
          Is it me, or is MOBIUS a horrible person?

          Comment

          • #6
            Not at all, if the Aboriginals stop getting drunk and ask for their land back they can hav e it ...
            GM of MAFIA #40 ,#41, #43, #45,#47,#49-#51,#53-#58,#61,#68,#70, #71

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            • #7
              Normans out of Britain NOW!!

              -Arrian
              grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

              The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

              Comment

              • #8
                Actually, I'll drink to that!

                And the English can **** off while they're at it!
                Is it me, or is MOBIUS a horrible person?

                Comment

                • #9
                  PICTLAND FTW!

                  -Arrian
                  grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

                  The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    yee hah the revolution has begun ... we better all pack our bags..
                    GM of MAFIA #40 ,#41, #43, #45,#47,#49-#51,#53-#58,#61,#68,#70, #71

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Re: Israeli settlers

                      Originally posted by Wernazuma III
                      Opening an own thread because I don't want to threadjack another one.



                      Just curious: who here claimed that settlers are subhumans?
                      Either we have some really serious dickhead among us who is best to be put on ignore or you're malinterpreting things.


                      One really serious question: How are the "legal" titles of the settling plots handled? Who claims to possess the land in the first place, who gives them out?
                      Prove me wrong, but I doubt that the Palestine communes nearby the settlements have a say in the process... I also doubt that many Palestinians are selling their land to Israeli settlers.
                      The whole settlement policy is outright land robbing, wild west style. Palestinians are being treated just like Americans treated Indians.
                      For my part, I would resist the land robbing and do fight to expel those who unjustly take what is not theirs.

                      It would be so easy to be on Israel's side, but the ongoing theft of Palestinian lands makes it impossible for me.

                      The land the west bank settlements are on is state land. Being the historian you are, Im sure you know that under the Ottoman empire ALL land was state land, and was allocated for use to farmers through a variety of means, often with a feudatorie/tax collecter over the peasants, but unlike in western europe the Ottoman state went to some trouble to keep these from being hereditary.

                      At some point, im not sure when, villages gained control over cultivated land. Nonfarmed land, however, remained the property of the state. Vast areas of non-arable or marginal land were still in state hands when the british mandate began, and were in turn taken over by the Jordanian state in 1948. When Israel took control in 1967, she planted settlements on some of this state land. Since the settlers are NOT farmers the fact that they are not on farmed land is not an issues. In general, IIUC, the pal villages are in the valleys, the settlements are on hilltops.

                      And yes, I have read that the Pals do find this amounts to economic pressure, since in past times a village would expand into nearby non-farmed land and bring it into cultivation, and the state would allocate it to the village. The settlements meant that in some places such expansion was no longer possible. Econonomic pressure, yes. A mark against the overall settlement policy, yes. Land theft, no.

                      See, its a very good idea to be more informed before making judgements. this is a more complex situation than you may realize.
                      "A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Re: Israeli settlers

                        Originally posted by Wernazuma III
                        Opening an own thread because I don't want to threadjack another one.
                        Im recalling some things said during the Gaza evacuation. And if subhuman was an exageration, certainly there was a complete absence of sympathy on many peoples part for the settlers, in contrast to the sentiment expressed by Spiffor wrt to Russians in Estonia, which is why i jumped on that.
                        "A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber

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                        • #13
                          I like none settlers.

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                          • #14
                            not available in CIV 4
                            GM of MAFIA #40 ,#41, #43, #45,#47,#49-#51,#53-#58,#61,#68,#70, #71

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Arrian
                              Normans out of Britain NOW!!

                              -Arrian
                              Turks out of Turkey
                              I'm about to get aroused from watching the pokemon and that's awesome. - Pekka

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