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I never claimed in my tone or elsewhere that soldiers are "dufuses." Better luck next timeI wasn't addressing an arguement at all merely a tone that I find objectionable.
"Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
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No you merely automatically discounted any opinion as less worthy than so called more informed sources. Inference - 'dog faces' grunts, (or other dismissive epitaph for someone actually doing something over there) don't know squat. In other words, dufuses.
Lets see we got Joint Chiefs, Abisaid, and Powell. So that is 6+1+1 vs. 15 dogfaces.
The ayes have it."Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson
“In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy CarterComment
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Not knowing the best way to resolve a very complicated situation is not equivalent to being a dufus. And yes, I do think that the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Colon Powell, and John Abizaid are much more qualified in strategory than a tiny sample of non-officers that may not be representative. Pardon me for valuing education and experience...
The article also doesn't address the numbers needed, which is they pivotal issue here. The Bush-McCain surge is probably too small by an order of magnitude."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
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the generals and the pentagon all say the war cannot be won ONLY militarily. Only BH seems to think that the political process is unaffected by the security situation.Originally posted by Zkribbler
The Baker/Hamilton Committee says the war cannot be won militarily.
The generals on the ground say the war cannot be won militarily.
The Pentagon says the war cannot be won militarily.
But a few dogfaces believe it can be.
So, whose advice would you follow?
"A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin BuberComment
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Originally posted by Ramo
The article also doesn't address the numbers needed, which is they pivotal issue here. The Bush-McCain surge is probably too small by an order of magnitude.
And could very well be the reason why the aforementioned feel it improper to send over. Or perhaps the feeling is that the duration of the stay is too short and that surging is not the answer but a longer term solution. The opinions of the soldiers may indeed not at all be at odds with your oppositional cadre despite your implication to the contrary. The only statement of the soliders is they need more. The commanders may well feel that more is likewise required but can't muster the requisite numbers.
Likewsie the ohhh so ignorant (lets put it the proper context they're not dufuses they're simply ignorant
) soliders may not feel surging or the level of troops an appropriate answer. They simply asked for more.
"Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson
“In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy CarterComment
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Abizaid has been going along with the Rumsfeld strategy for a long time ("Whatever the question in Iraq is, 140,000 troops is the answer") I could see hed have a hard time admitting he was wrong all along. Powell has not had a military role in the occupation of Iraq, and presumably is at least in part at fault that hardly anyone in the embassy in Iraq even speaks Arabic. He has long been engaged in an inside the beltway struggle against the neocons, and be extension against McCain.Originally posted by Ramo
Not knowing the best way to resolve a very complicated situation is not equivalent to being a dufus. And yes, I do think that the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Colon Powell, and John Abizaid are much more qualified in strategory than a tiny sample of non-officers that may not be representative. Pardon me for valuing education and experience...
The article also doesn't address the numbers needed, which is they pivotal issue here. The Bush-McCain surge is probably too small by an order of magnitude.
Gates should certainly take into account what Abizaid and Powell have to say, but he should also look at a range of opinions, including other generals, other officers such as colonels and majors, and other sources of ideas as well."A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin BuberComment
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i would note that the soldiers, unlike the generals, havent spent months putting their initials to reports claiming the Iraqi army is all trained up well and good."A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin BuberComment
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This article echoes the words of all the military, and their families, that I've had the good fortune to speak with.
They don't want to stop in the middle. They want it to be completed. They naturally mourn their friends that have been lost, but want the losses to be for a reason.
Cut and run now, it would have been for nothing.Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
"Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ BraindeadComment
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Then they might as well have asked for magical fairies. A few hundred thousand more troops would be nice to have, but so would Santa Claus. But I was addressing the title's inference (presumably in favor of the Bush-McCain surge) than what the soldier's actually said (since the article doesn't go in-depth).Likewsie the ohhh so ignorant (lets put it the proper context they're not dufuses they're simply ignorant ) soliders may not feel surging or the level of troops an appropriate answer. They simply asked for more."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
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Originally posted by Ramo
But I was addressing the title's inference (presumably in favor of the Bush-McCain surge) than what the soldier's actually said (since the article doesn't go in-depth).
Then thats a faulty inference by you as Slowwy didn't even mention McCain/Bush surging proposals. They simply asked for men to do the job.
I doubt they were given detailed plans as to staffing levels and rotations."Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson
“In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy CarterComment
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Missing the point. I meant Sloww's likely inference."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
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Misssed my Dans as slowwy made no such inference."Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson
“In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy CarterComment
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Any realistic increase in troop numbers would be along the lines of the Bush-McCain surge."Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
-BokononComment
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