Amish school massacre -- a "number" of people dead

[DRoseDARs]

MrFun was being facetious.

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by DRoseDARs MrFun was being facetious.

I know. He was sarcastically praising the "gun culture" so as to denigrate it and blame it for the school shootings.

That is why I responded to him the way that I did.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Wycoff
I'm not a pro 2nd amendment guy, but the gun issue seems secondary to the proliferation of murdering nut jobs.

Murdering nut jobs are common in all societies, but the easy access to guns in the U.S. makes it easier for the idiots to massacre people. In places with stricter gun control laws, these massacres occur less frequently, if not very rarely. So gun control is very much a primary issue in these incidents.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Originally posted by Wycoff


It's interesting to me that that is the first response for so many people.

What disturbs me more is that our society is producing people who want to go into a school and kill children.
Why is the first thing that stikes you about the situation the method the man used to kill the children? I'm not a pro 2nd amendment guy, but the gun issue seems secondary to the proliferation of murdering nut jobs.

I actually doubt thet there's been "proliferation of murdering nut jobs" . . . as opposed to a proliferation of bottom-feeding cable news networks that live for this stuff.

But let's suppose you're right. Maybe it's not gun culture (a fair bet, since the "gun culture" aspect of our society is pretty much an historical constant). But then, what is it? Violent music? Video games? Something dark in the American soul, whatever that is? What?

[Dis]

no, he's right. It's a gun culture. I knew guys like this in the navy. Guys who thought it's cool load their own bullets with powder (I'm too drunk to remember what this is called). But I have known guys who loaded their own bullets.

something is not right with american culture. I can't explain how it turned out this way, but it is this way. I blame the french and ww2. . just kidding. but ww2 does have it's impact (the fact that we won, and didn't get our asses kicked).

Obviously it's not violent music, or video games. They are the result of a violent culture, not the cause of a violent culture.

But why are we violent? I mentioned above WW2. The fact that we didn't get our asses kicked. The fact that we kicked major ass in ww2 and never had any serious defeat. Sure china kicked our ass a bit in the Korean war, but we rebounded. And the Vietnam war we technically won every battle. guns are just part of american culture.

You know what bothers me? In Greta Van Sustren's show they mentioned he was a quiet guy. Guys like this give us quiet guys a bad name, and I don't like it. . *******. Why can't it ever be some loudmouth ******* who kills a lot of people, it's always the quiet guy. I guess it scares me that I could be one of these people and not know it.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly


I actually doubt thet there's been "proliferation of murdering nut jobs" . . . as opposed to a proliferation of bottom-feeding cable news networks that live for this stuff.

I think regardless of whether the population of "nut jobs" is rising, falling or remaining constant they do tend to get their marching orders from society - which in most cases seems to be the media. These people have a need for attention and seek to do the worst thing possible to show everyone the depth of their pain and self-loathing. Perhaps knowing this the media can try and feature less lethal "crimes" like nose-picking in public or somesuch.

[Dis]

are you crazy! I don't want more people nose picking in public.

[Tingkai]

Yeah, it's the media's fault. Nothing to do with the guy just being wacked out crazy. Nothing to do with easy access to guns. Just blame the media. We're used to it.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Originally posted by Tingkai
Yeah, it's the media's fault. Nothing to do with the guy just being wacked out crazy. Nothing to do with easy access to guns. Just blame the media. We're used to it.

In truth, I don't think you can blame the media, because the media is as bad or worse elsewhere -- the UK, for example -- without producing this kind of effect.

But that's the point: he's not a lone nut. In fact, there seem to be a frightening number of nuts just like him. So you've got to ask: why does the US produce so many violent wackos?

And if the answer is, "hey, we just do, okay?" then you've got to wonder if easy access to guns is such a great idea. It's a little like knowing you live in an area prone to earthquakes, but refusing to have building codes.

[Wezil]

I just want the media to stop endlessly reporting the names of the shooters. Let them remain anonymous. The recent shooter in Montreal wanted to be (im)famous and the media obliged.

[Lorizael]

Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly
But that's the point: he's not a lone nut. In fact, there seem to be a frightening number of nuts just like him. So you've got to ask: why does the US produce so many violent wackos?

And if the answer is, "hey, we just do, okay?" then you've got to wonder if easy access to guns is such a great idea. It's a little like knowing you live in an area prone to earthquakes, but refusing to have building codes.

This is a very good point.

Anyways, I wish we could run a historical experiment on this. Take a culture that produces a high number of nutjobs, but give them knives instead of guns. Then let them loose.

Would it be any better?

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Wycoff


I know. He was sarcastically praising the "gun culture" so as to denigrate it and blame it for the school shootings.

That is why I responded to him the way that I did.

You're right -- guns have nothing to do with murders that are carried out with guns.




uh . . . . . .

[MrFun]

Originally posted by DRoseDARs
MrFun was being facetious.

[Jon Miller]

What gets me is that he picks Amish because they wont' fight back.. and then when he proves unsuccessful, he kills them?

I just don't understand this type of evilness.

JM

[Elok]

Originally posted by MrFun
You're right -- guns have nothing to do with murders that are carried out with guns.

Strawman. He was saying that the ability to possess guns is, or ought to be, less worrisome than the existence of crazy schleps who want to kill people they don't know. In this particular case, the possession of guns really was quite irrelevant; he was attacking the Amish, who are complete pacifists, and these were mostly children to boot. Probably the only weapon around for miles was maybe an axe or two for chopping wood (assuming one of their farms was nearby), and every single one of them had been raised with a very strong social stigma against violence anyway. Nobody there had even the most basic experience with combat. This nut could have achieved the same results with a homemade bow and arrows, or even a "spear" made out of a kitchen knife tied to a long stick.

I don't know that I would classify the man as "evil" as such. He seems to have been very emotionally disturbed, and his last notes/words suggest he felt compelled to do the things he did. I'm not saying he was a good man by any means, but we should be careful when judging people who are sick in the head.