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  • Pakistan and the War on Terror

    BBC, News, BBC News, news online, world, uk, international, foreign, british, online, service


    US 'threatened to bomb' Pakistan
    The US threatened to bomb Pakistan "back to the stone age" unless it joined the fight against al-Qaeda, President Pervez Musharraf has said.
    General Musharraf said the warning was delivered by former Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage to Pakistan's intelligence director.

    "I think it was a very rude remark," Mr Musharraf told CBS television.

    Pakistan agreed to side with the US, but Gen Musharraf said it did so based on his country's national interest.

    "One has to think and take actions in the interest of the nation, and that's what I did," he said.

    'Ludicrous' requests

    The extracts from the CBS show 60 Minutes, which will run on Sunday, were released on the same day that the White House praised Pakistan for its co-operation in America's "war on terror".

    Gen Musharraf is due to meet US President George W Bush at the White House on Friday.

    He is also due to launch his autobiography next week and some analysts say the timing of the revelation may be an attempt to generate interest in the book.


    The Pakistani president said that, following the attacks of 11 September 2001, the US made some "ludicrous" demands of Pakistan.
    "The intelligence director told me that Mr Armitage said, 'Be prepared to be bombed. Be prepared to go back to the Stone Age'," he said.

    The US envoy also insisted that Pakistan suppress domestic expression of support for attacks on the United States, he said.

    "If somebody's expressing views, we cannot curb the expression of views," Gen Musharraf said.

    Mr Armitage also allegedly demanded that Pakistan allow the US to use its border posts as staging points for the war on Afghanistan.

    Pakistan's support was considered crucial in the defeat of Afghanistan's Taleban government, which Pakistan had helped to bring to power.

    President Musharraf has proved a loyal ally though many now will question the means used to extract the co-operation, says the BBC's US state department correspondent Jonathan Beale.

    Story from BBC NEWS:
    BBC, News, BBC News, news online, world, uk, international, foreign, british, online, service


    Published: 2006/09/21 21:06:11 GMT

    © BBC MMVI


    Now, I don't know if Musharraf is exaggerating to placate the home crowd, or if the Bush way of spreading democracy really involves such ample use of intimidation. Do I really want to know?
    "The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists."
    -Joan Robinson

  • #2
    Yeah saw this on stuff.co.nz earlier this evening.

    Kinda crazy. Wonder if it happened.

    Comment


    • #3
      Hard to say. What's clear is that Pakistan is no longer on the US side in the "War on Terror", also known as the "Preparations to Attack Iran."
      Tecumseh's Village, Home of Fine Civilization Scenarios

      www.tecumseh.150m.com

      Comment


      • #4
        What?

        The US is deliberately trying to make Pakistan anti-US overtly in order to prepare for an attack on Iran?

        That the US wanted to attack Iran originally and that both Afghanistan and Iraq were side shows?

        That 9/11 was the beginning of a plan to attack Iran?

        Comment


        • #5
          It seems like a casual remark given at a time of insecurity as to the consequences for the region, depending on how the various players would react.

          It has been my experience that a lot of people say a lot of things. From time to time.

          I do wish him the best of luck with the sales of his autobiography though.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Flip McWho
            What?

            The US is deliberately trying to make Pakistan anti-US overtly in order to prepare for an attack on Iran?
            No.

            That the US wanted to attack Iran originally and that both Afghanistan and Iraq were side shows?
            Yes.

            That 9/11 was the beginning of a plan to attack Iran?
            Maybe.
            Tecumseh's Village, Home of Fine Civilization Scenarios

            www.tecumseh.150m.com

            Comment


            • #7
              No.
              I get that now, sorry I misunderstood that part.

              Yes.
              So afghanistan wasn't really in retaliation for 9/11?

              What purpose does attacking those two places serve if your aim is attack Iran?

              Maybe.
              So it was either a bloody convienant coincidence

              or

              A plan of the american govt to initiate the attack on Iran.



              You must think that the american administration is both incredibly devious and incredibly naive.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Flip McWho

                So afghanistan wasn't really in retaliation for 9/11?

                What purpose does attacking those two places serve if your aim is attack Iran?
                Look at a map. Bases and all. Trouble is, the war in both places isn't going very well, otherwise things might have already advanced to the next war.

                So it was either a bloody convienant coincidence

                or

                A plan of the american govt to initiate the attack on Iran.
                Lot's of people do, I'm not really sure. Maybe a coincidence well exploited.



                You must think that the american administration is both incredibly devious and incredibly naive.
                No. I'm more in the Chavez school. Smell the sulfur.
                Tecumseh's Village, Home of Fine Civilization Scenarios

                www.tecumseh.150m.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  Look at a map. Bases and all. Trouble is, the war in both places isn't going very well, otherwise things might have already advanced to the next war.
                  Fair enough, understandable.

                  I still have problems with the thinking that Afghanistan wasn't in revenge of 9/11 but a part of a well crafted plan that just happened to have a catalyst to initiate it.

                  So:
                  Lot's of people do, I'm not really sure. Maybe a coincidence well exploited.
                  Lotsa people believe lotsa things. How many believe that everything was created 6000 years ago?

                  I can grant you the coincidence well exploited though.

                  One final thing.

                  Why do you believe that the administration is doing this?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    SHOW ME THE MONEY !!!!
                    "Ceterum censeo Ben esse expellendum."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      The U.S. doesn't need a years old diversion of Iraq to attack Iran. Don't be stupid.
                      Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                      "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                      He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        @ techumseh. You really are a loon.

                        ...

                        I have little doubt that various US officials said all that stuff and more to Musharraf right after 9/11.

                        It's not like Pakistan is much of an ally. They don't like us much, we don't really like them much. Asking nicely wasn't likely to yield the results we wanted, so we threatened them. Things aren't exactly peachy, but whaddya gonna do? Invade Pakistan, a nuclear power? No.

                        -Arrian
                        grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

                        The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Arrian
                          It's not like Pakistan is much of an ally.
                          I'd say that they've been quite loyal, myself.
                          I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                          For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Pakistani clerics demand pope's removal

                            By ASIF SHAHZAD, Associated Press Writer
                            Thu Sep 21, 6:37 PM ET

                            LAHORE, Pakistan - About 1,000 Muslim clerics and religious scholars meeting Thursday in eastern Pakistan demanded the removal of
                            Pope Benedict XVI for making what they called "insulting remarks" against Islam.

                            Benedict "should be removed from his position immediately for encouraging war and fanning hostility between various faiths" and "making insulting remarks" against Islam, said a joint statement issued by the clerics and scholars at the end of their one-day convention.

                            The "pope, and all infidels, should know that no Muslim, under any circumstances, can tolerate an insult to the Prophet (Muhammad). ... If the West does not change its stance regarding Islam, it will face severe consequences," it said.

                            The meeting was organized by the radical Islamic group Jamaat al-Dawat, which runs schools, colleges and medical clinics. In April, Washington put the group on a list of terrorist organizations for its alleged links with militants fighting in the Indian part of
                            Kashmir.

                            The meeting came after the pope said Sunday he was "deeply sorry" about the reactions to his remarks and that they did not reflect his own opinions.

                            He said Wednesday that he has "deep respect" for Islam, but he did not offer an apology that was demanded by some Muslim leaders offended by his remarks in Germany last week.

                            The pope acknowledged that his remarks were open to misinterpretation, but insisted he had not intended to endorse a negative view of Islam.

                            In Germany, Benedict cited the words of a Byzantine emperor who characterized some of the teachings of the Prophet Muhammad as "evil and inhuman," particularly "his command to spread by the sword the faith."

                            "This quote unfortunately lent itself to be misunderstood," the pontiff said Wednesday. "In no way did I wish to make my own the words of the medieval emperor. I wished to explain that not religion and violence, but religion and reason go together."

                            The clerics and religious scholars said they did not regard Benedict's latest comments as an apology.

                            "The pope has neither accepted his mistake, nor apologized for his words," it said.

                            The statement also said jihad was not terrorism and that "Islam was not propagated with the sword, but it became popular and was accepted by the oppressed peoples of the world because of its universal values and teachings."

                            "Jihad is waged to rid an area, state, or the world of oppression, violence, cruelty, and terrorism, and bring peace and relief to the people. History is full of incidents where Muslims waged jihad to provide relief to people of many faiths, especially Jews and Christians," it said.

                            Pakistan is the world's second most populous Muslim country, and its people have held small, peaceful rallies since the publication of pope's remarks about Islam.

                            A) The underlined shows the good sense of Pakistan.
                            B) Here's hoping they continue having good sense.
                            C) They can call for the removal of the pope all day, but it's not their call to make; no more than if they decided they didn't agree with .... India.
                            D) The clerics have some huge gonads, talking about advocation of war by the pope.
                            E) I'm not Catholic, nor am I Muslim. I don't have a horse in this race.
                            Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                            "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                            He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DinoDoc
                              I'd say that they've been quite loyal, myself.
                              If you view Pakistan as a truely united entity, maybe. I don't see it that way. Some of Pakistan is a loyal... somethingorother - I don't think "ally" necessarily works given the relationship. Vassal?

                              Some of Pakistan is with the enemy, and the part loyal to us (for the moment, anyway) can't seem to do all that much about it.

                              -Arrian
                              grog want tank...Grog Want Tank... GROG WANT TANK!

                              The trick isn't to break some eggs to make an omelette, it's convincing the eggs to break themselves in order to aspire to omelettehood.

                              Comment

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