Native Spanish speakers: can you help me on this?

[Wernazuma III]

Originally posted by Thorgal
So to refer to Jesus resurection as a historical fact you would say simply "Jesucristo resucitó". This difference is mostly done in Spain and in most formal texts in general like the religious texts, I think that in Latin America colloquial spanish it is more common to use the "preterito perfecto simple" in both cases.

Well, at least in Chile, almost everything is "indefinido" - in a grammatical sense I mean (Chile is not central America ).

Btw., isn't it in English the same? Present perfect also connects to the present (as the very name indicates).

[Straybow]

Perhaps "Jesucristo resucitó" is closer to "the risen Christ" than "Christ is risen." To me this English construction is closer to the Greek middle voice, which English lacks. "Christ arose" is active voice, "Christ was raised" is passive.

With this tradition being an Eastern one, perhaps Elok should find out how the Romanians say it. I was better able to communicate to some Romanians in pidgeon Spanish that they in their pidgeon English.

[fed1943]

Thorgal: I was a native Spanish/Castillian speaker until I was three years old. And still keep that 3 years old "knowledge".

That rise/revive question: if they are thinking "....to save us" (or other intention/consequence) must we keep the "revive" translation or go to the "rise"?

Best regards,

[Thorgal]

@Straybow:

Risen Christ would be "Cristo resucitado" in this case "resucitado" works as an adjective. I think that "Christ resucitó" is closer to "Christ arose".

"Christ is risen" would be "Cristo está resucitado". As Werna says it is rarely used in this case, becasue "estar" means "un estado del ser" state of the being, not an inherent "consustancial" characteristic of the being, while the resurrection is something inherent to the risen Christ. OTOH "Cristo es resucitado" is a present passive voice, Meaning that somebody else is resurrecting Christ now.

The past passive voice "Christ was raised" would be "Cristo fue resucitado".

[Jaguar]

Originally posted by Thorgal

That is not Spanish. It sounds like some sort of latin mixed with some sort of catalan.

I was about to call him out on that. And he's a Texan, too. He should at least know that Spanish doesn't have a double S.

[Aabraxan]

Originally posted by Ecthy
Different dialects use different modal verbs for perfect tense constructions. Example:

South Germany, Austria: Ich bin dort gestanden.

Normal : Ich habe dort gestanden.

Using different definitions of what kind of verb "stehen" ('stand') is and how it should be conjugated in Perfekt.

If by "normal," you mean High German, I thought this was the other way around:

Ich bin dort gestanden.

[Wernazuma III]

Originally posted by Aabraxan


If by "normal," you mean High German, I thought this was the other way around:

Ich bin dort gestanden.

Of course, "normal" here only means the dialect spoken near his charcoal hut.
But of course you're right, it's been us who brought civilization to northern barbarians.

[Last Conformist]

"Christ is risen" is just archaic English for "Christ has risen".

[SlowwHand]

It's what is taught in Spanish classes.

quote:
Originally posted by SlowwHand
(Spanish "formal", as in Spain) Spanish (Castilan): Crist ha ressuscitat! En veritat ha ressuscitatado!

That is not Spanish. It sounds like some sort of latin mixed with some sort of catalan.

[Terra Nullius]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
"Christ is risen" is just archaic English for "Christ has risen".

Que??

What are you basing that on? Cos it don't seem right to moi.

"The bread has risen" uses a past participle to describe an action that took place in the past, but which is still in effect at the present moment.

"The bread is risen" uses an adjective to describe the condition of the bread at the present moment.

"The bread is raised" (eg. by using yeast) uses the passive voice to describe a general procedure by which the bread can be acted upon by some other agent.

[SlowwHand]

So take THAT.

[Barnabas]

It is impossibly to translate that perfect into spanish, implying both that jesus resurrected (in the past) and is still alive resurrected ( and in heaven) which is risen implies.

To translate that in spanish you would need a rather long sentence, because Ha resucitado only means (he resurrected)

[SlowwHand]

It is impossibly to translate that perfect into spanish,"

Another example.

[civman2000]

Originally posted by Terra Nullius

Que??

What are you basing that on? Cos it don't seem right to moi.

"The bread has risen" uses a past participle to describe an action that took place in the past, but which is still in effect at the present moment.

"The bread is risen" uses an adjective to describe the condition of the bread at the present moment.

"The bread is raised" (eg. by using yeast) uses the passive voice to describe a general procedure by which the bread can be acted upon by some other agent.

No, he's right. "The bread is risen" isn't even grammatical in modern English, but around 600 years ago meant "The bread has risen".

[GePap]

Originally posted by SlowwHand
It's what is taught in Spanish classes.

Then your teachers were awful, cause as Thorgal stated, that isn't Spanish.