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**notyoueither** · April 30, 2006, 22:34

Hold on. Here we go.

**Dinner** · April 30, 2006, 22:43

Naw, these cross border skirmishes happen every once in a while. The Kurds are secular and like us but they really are a bunch of hyper nationalist twits who want to start revolutions in Turkey, Iran, Syria, Iraq, and even Armenia to "liberate" areas they believe should be part of an independent Kurdish homeland. Naturally, all of the other countries in the region don't like this idea and so there is often fighting between Kurdish rebel groups and the armed forces of the various other countries in the region.

**Zkribbler** · April 30, 2006, 22:45

According to the article, this is the second cross-boarder incursion in the same area.

WTF are the Iranians up to??

They're attacking anti-Turkisih Kurds? These Kurds have some ties to anti-Iranian Kurds, sure, but is that enough to motivate an mini-invasion?

So if you're Iraq, what do you do....station some Kurdish forces in the area...or move up some of your Shia troops from the South?

I wonder if the U.S. will send some powerful air units up there. Iran moves in troops, and we fry their hides after they cross into Iraq.

I hear the echos of what the Captain of the Enterprise says in The Hunt for Red October: "This is going to get out of control! Out of control!"

**Dinner** · April 30, 2006, 23:01

The PKK is a communist Kurdish group which originated in Turkish Kurdistan but who has been mostly pushed out of Turkey into neighboring countries. Most of the Kurdish rebel groups stress the common struggle for Kurdish self rule throughout the region and actively work together. It's been that way since the 1970's.

**notyoueither** · April 30, 2006, 23:05

What hasn't been happening the 70's is an American occupation of Iraq and a president boiling for excuses to bomb Iran... according to The Plan.

**Cyclotron** · April 30, 2006, 23:12

From my perspective, this looks potentially positive. There's nothing like an outside threat to remind the Iraqi Kurds that there is some value in remaining part of the state. Traditionally, the Kurds have been very fragmented, with not much cooperation across borders - Iranian action directly upon Iraqi Kurds might have an effect that action on Iranian Kurds would not.

**GePap** · April 30, 2006, 23:49

The Turks used to cross into Iraq all the time in the 90's, and in the early 70's the Iranians under the Shah also went after Kurdish rebels inside Iraq.

One more reason why the disintergation of Iraq would have serious consequences.

**Jon Miller** · April 30, 2006, 23:52

Originally posted by Oerdin
Naw, these cross border skirmishes happen every once in a while. The Kurds are secular and like us but they really are a bunch of hyper nationalist twits who want to start revolutions in Turkey, Iran, Syria, Iraq, and even Armenia to "liberate" areas they believe should be part of an independent Kurdish homeland. Naturally, all of the other countries in the region don't like this idea and so there is often fighting between Kurdish rebel groups and the armed forces of the various other countries in the region.

Kurds took part in the armenian genocide

JM

**Ancyrean** · May 1, 2006, 12:17

Originally posted by GePap
The Turks used to cross into Iraq all the time in the 90's, and in the early 70's the Iranians under the Shah also went after Kurdish rebels inside Iraq.

One more reason why the disintergation of Iraq would have serious consequences.

Actually, Turkish army has amassed more than 200.000 troops along the entire length of the Turkish-Iraqi border in the past two weeks, and i'm totally amazed at the lack of mention of this in the international media.

Turkish newspapers speculated that the army was in for a massive incursion into Northern Iraq with the aim of destroying a number of PKK bases still active in the area. These bases act as a springboard for a string of recent attacks on Turkish military patrols and the unwillingness of the US to do something about them is being an increasing point of tension between Turkey and US.

The Americans, despite the fact that they have recognised PKK and its phoney-named affiliates as terrorist, declare nonchalantly that they are not the authority in Iraq so that Turkey should instead seek the help of the Iraqi government. Right... They also say that they have their hands tied against the insurgency in the south so they have no troops to spare against any operation in the north. Again, as if they have no more guided bombs or cruise missiles to visit these bases...Right....

Furthermore, nevermind the fact that there's no credible Iraqi government whatsoever to talk to in the first place and if there were, they don't have anything remotely near to an army who would manage a coordinated attack on a crack rebel stronghold. And even if they could pull it off, it is as if the Kurdish government in the north would watch an Arab army start fireworks deep in its territory. What a joke....

Public opinion here is simmering with accusations of treacherous hypocrisy on the part of US (as in "my terrorist: Bad bad bad. Your terrorist which I also recognise: suck it up") and frankly I'm not convinced at all by the American explanations about their inaction against the PKK.

Condi Rice was here just last week and she was reassured that the Turkish army was deployed along the border just to stop fresh PKK incursions to come with the oncoming spring thaw. However, Turkish media was awash this week with reports of Turkish army units having crossed the border numerous times up to 15 km in pursuit of fleeing PKK groups...Speculation still abounds here that soon the army will launch a major invasion of norhtern parts of North Iraq.

By the way, although PKK was set up in Turkey and their main theatre of operations is in Turkey, they also stupidly don't refrain to stir things up in Iran as well, which pisses Iranians off real bad, hence their recent operation to clean up their side of the border.

**Cyclotron** · May 1, 2006, 16:26

The problem is that the US needs the PKK and others like them to maintain Kurdish commitment to the Iraqi state. If the Americans take action against the Kurds, the Kurds might try to secede - and wouldn't you agree that an independent Kurdistan in northern Iraq would be far more of a problem for Turkey than some PKK raids launched from northern Iraq?

**Arrian** · May 1, 2006, 16:40

Sounds to me like we might be giving the Turks a green light to take care of business. For reasons that should be fairly obvious, we can't pick a fight with the Kurds, even if they are being terrorist bastards. They're our terrorist bastards right now. Or we hope they are.

-Arrian

**Ramo** · May 1, 2006, 16:50

I recently read a nearly identical report about Turks shelling PKK positions in Iraqi Kurdistan (which makes a lot more sense). I wonder if there's some identity confusion between Iranians and Turks.

**Ramo** · May 1, 2006, 16:51

Or maybe both at the same time. Interesting...

**Ramo** · May 1, 2006, 16:53

Page doesn't exist

http://www.voanews.com/english/2006-04-26-voa51.cfm

Turkey denied the charges that they made incursions into Iraq, while Iran has no official response AFAIK.

Announcement

omg Iran 'attacks Iraq Kurdish area'

omg Iran 'attacks Iraq Kurdish area'

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