Tel Aviv bombing is part of self-defense: Hamas

[Cort Haus]

What's clear to me is that if a non-government Israeli group sent a suicide bomb into a Palestinian restaurant, and the Israeli government said "not us, but we applaud it", the mere support would be seen as an effective act of aggression by that government.

By applauding it, Hamas effectively claims some responsibility - otherwise, how can they claim to be trying to stop it?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by DRoseDARs
Wait, if the Palestinians are now some sort of quasi-independant nation/state, wouldn't Israel's recent attacks/strikes against targets in Palestinian lands constitute acts of war? Must be since Hamas voicing support for the actions of other groups constitutes an "act of war" against Israel. So technically, Israel already declared war. So how's about stfu before KH school's you some more?

There are some on the right in Israel who think there is a state of war already, and want Israel to attack Hamas without restraint. The Olmert govt has not done this, and has limited itself to attacks on Islamic Jihad and the AAMB, groups which the PA has refrained from cracking down on. However statements like this make it much harder for the Olmert govt to continue this moderate policy.

[KrazyHorse]

The responsibility I'm referring to is in the basic, conceptual sense firstly.

What the **** does this mean?

[DRoseDARs]

Thank you for the reasoned response to that post lotm.

[KrazyHorse]

[QUOTE] Originally posted by lord of the mark

Originally posted by KrazyHorse

No, it doesn't.

It places upon them responsibility commensurate with their ability to prevent such attacks.

They ALREADY have such responsibility, by virtue of being the govt of the PA.

I already said that.

[Winston]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse

The responsibility I'm referring to is in the basic, conceptual sense firstly.

What the **** does this mean?

Um, that they are responsible for it?

As opposed to you starting to bring potential consequences and repercussions into it.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Sirotnikov

Did your country also stop known hamas-related charities from operating inside its territory?
serious question.

Hamas is on our "terrorist organizations" list (has been for about 2 years IIRC)

That means that it is illegal for any organisation operating in our territory to give Hamas any money.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Winston


Um, that they are responsible for it?

I already said that they were partly responsible for this. You can find my post stating that somewhere on the first half of the first page.

Do you want to continue making hay with a non-issue?

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Secondly, of course Hamas is responsible for its own actions. If it condones such attacks and does nothing to prevent them, then as the purported government of the PA it takes some responsibility for the damage inflicted.

[Sirotnikov]

Originally posted by DRoseDARs
Wait, if the Palestinians are now some sort of quasi-independant nation/state, wouldn't Israel's recent attacks/strikes against targets in Palestinian lands constitute acts of war? Must be since Hamas voicing support for the actions of other groups constitutes an "act of war" against Israel. So technically, Israel already declared war. So how's about stfu before KH school's you some more?

Pffft... tough schooling

As LOTM says - in many ways this is already a war. The palestinian side for the matter a fact utilizes around 90% of its efforts in agression towards Israel.

Israel has been the one, that until recently has been restraining itself.

So if anyone has declared war - it were the Palestinian militants by launching rockets.

Or perhaps by launching the first suicide bomber. Or perhaps by capturing the first Israeli plane. Or perhaps by attacking peaceful undefended Jewish cities in the 1920s. I forget...

[Arrian]

What Cort Haus said. That's it exactly. Sure, it was IJ that actually carried out the attack, but Hamas just put themselves on the record as approving of IJ's actions. And they have the gall to try and justify it by whining about the cutoffs of aid money. **** them.

-Arrian

[KrazyHorse]

Siro

You really don't want to go that far back, kid.

[Sirotnikov]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Hamas is on our "terrorist organizations" list (has been for about 2 years IIRC)

That means that it is illegal for any organisation operating in our territory to give Hamas any money.

Wonderful.

Are you enforcing that?

I could give you a list of several Hamas related charities. Would you check if they are legal in your country?

[Winston]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
I already said that they were partly responsible for this.

You also said they were only responsible to the extent that they could have prevented it. This is where I disagree, since by their applauding the attack, the question of whether they could have stopped it becomes rather pointless. They wouldn't have, even if they could, which bestows upon them equal responsibility for the killings.

Now stop apologizing for these bastards.

[KrazyHorse]

The organisations may be legal. It is a matter of proving that they funnel money to Hamas. If it's shown that they do, then their assets can be seized and their agents imprisoned.

I honestly don't know what the current state of prosecutions is. The simple threat of such actions might have forced a lot of them to shut their doors and relocate their assets to avoid large losses.