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Muslims, Danish Pastries, and Cartoons - an editioral

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  • Muslims, Danish Pastries, and Cartoons - an editioral

    I saw this editorial and I thought it was interesting enough to bring to you guys and wanted to hear your opinions.

    Does the author have a valid point here? That "reasonable" voices in Muslim world are basically jerking us off?

    Curse of the Moderates

    By Charles Krauthammer
    Friday, February 10, 2006; A19

    As much of the Islamic world erupts in a studied frenzy over the Danish Muhammad cartoons, there are voices of reason being heard on both sides. Some Islamic leaders and organizations, while endorsing the demonstrators' sense of grievance and sharing their outrage, speak out against using violence as a vehicle of expression. Their Western counterparts -- intellectuals, including most of the major newspapers in the United States -- are similarly balanced: While, of course, endorsing the principle of free expression, they criticize the Danish newspaper for abusing that right by publishing offensive cartoons, and they declare themselves opposed, in the name of religious sensitivity, to doing the same.

    God save us from the voices of reason.

    What passes for moderation in the Islamic community -- "I share your rage but don't torch that embassy" -- is nothing of the sort. It is simply a cynical way to endorse the goals of the mob without endorsing its means. It is fraudulent because, while pretending to uphold the principle of religious sensitivity, it is interested only in this instance of religious insensitivity.

    Have any of these "moderates" ever protested the grotesque caricatures of Christians and, most especially, Jews that are broadcast throughout the Middle East on a daily basis? The sermons on Palestinian TV that refer to Jews as the sons of pigs and monkeys? The Syrian prime-time TV series that shows rabbis slaughtering a gentile boy to ritually consume his blood? The 41-part (!) series on Egyptian TV based on that anti-Semitic czarist forgery (and inspiration of the Nazis), "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion," showing the Jews to be engaged in a century-old conspiracy to control the world?

    A true Muslim moderate is one who protests desecrations of all faiths. Those who don't are not moderates but hypocrites, opportunists and agents for the rioters, merely using different means to advance the same goal: to impose upon the West, with its traditions of freedom of speech, a set of taboos that is exclusive to the Islamic faith. These are not defenders of religion but Muslim supremacists trying to force their dictates upon the liberal West.

    And these "moderates" are aided and abetted by Western "moderates" who publish pictures of the Virgin Mary covered with elephant dung and celebrate the "Piss Christ" (a crucifix sitting in a jar of urine) as art deserving public subsidy, but who are seized with a sudden religious sensitivity when the subject is Muhammad.

    Had they not been so hypocritical, one might defend their refusal to republish these cartoons on the grounds that news value can sometimes be trumped by good taste and sensitivity. After all, on grounds of basic decency, American newspapers generally -- and correctly -- do not publish pictures of dead bodies, whatever their news value.

    There is a "sensitivity" argument for not having published the cartoons in the first place, back in September when they first appeared in that Danish newspaper. But it is not September. It is February. The cartoons have been published, and the newspaper, the publishers and Denmark itself have come under savage attack. After multiple arsons, devastating boycotts, and threats to cut off hands and heads, the issue is no longer news value, i.e., whether a newspaper needs to publish them to inform the audience about what is going on. The issue now is solidarity.

    The mob is trying to dictate to Western newspapers, indeed Western governments, what is a legitimate subject for discussion and caricature. The cartoons do not begin to approach the artistic level of Salman Rushdie's prose, but that's not the point. The point is who decides what can be said and what can be drawn within the precincts of what we quaintly think of as the free world.

    The mob has turned this into a test case for freedom of speech in the West. The German, French and Italian newspapers that republished these cartoons did so not to inform but to defy -- to declare that they will not be intimidated by the mob.

    What is at issue is fear. The unspoken reason many newspapers do not want to republish is not sensitivity but simple fear. They know what happened to Theo van Gogh, who made a film about the Islamic treatment of women and got a knife through the chest with an Islamist manifesto attached.

    The worldwide riots and burnings are instruments of intimidation, reminders of van Gogh's fate. The Islamic "moderates" are the mob's agents and interpreters, warning us not to do this again. And the Western "moderates" are their terrified collaborators who say: Don't worry, we won't. It's those Danes. We're clean. Spare us. Please.

    letters@charleskrauthammer.com
    © 2006 The Washington Post Company
    Who is Barinthus?

  • #2
    The mob has turned this into a test case for freedom of speech in the West. The German, French and Italian newspapers that republished these cartoons did so not to inform but to defy -- to declare that they will not be intimidated by the mob.


    Which is stupid. Let's violate our (the papers) own standards for offensiveness and newsworthiness simply to 'defy'. Why don't we just have the NY Times post the Hustler parody of Jerry Falwell to 'defy' his attempts to censor it .
    “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
    - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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    • #3
      And the WaPo wins another price for its crap editorials.


      What passes for moderation in the Islamic community -- "I share your rage but don't torch that embassy" -- is nothing of the sort. It is simply a cynical way to endorse the goals of the mob without endorsing its means. It is fraudulent because, while pretending to uphold the principle of religious sensitivity, it is interested only in this instance of religious insensitivity.


      Wow. So pro-lifers either have to agree with the murder of doctors or be hypocrits covertly sharing the murderer's agenda? how stupid is that?


      Have any of these "moderates" ever protested the grotesque caricatures of Christians and, most especially, Jews that are broadcast throughout the Middle East on a daily basis? The sermons on Palestinian TV that refer to Jews as the sons of pigs and monkeys? The Syrian prime-time TV series that shows rabbis slaughtering a gentile boy to ritually consume his blood? The 41-part (!) series on Egyptian TV based on that anti-Semitic czarist forgery (and inspiration of the Nazis), "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion," showing the Jews to be engaged in a century-old conspiracy to control the world?


      So an old conservative fart living in Washington and probably not speaking a single word of Arabic knows what they think? and suddenly becomes an expert on panarabian politics? Millions of injustices are commited every day, blaming someone for not standing against all of them is the most retarded thing to do. Hey dip****, here's an idea: why don't you spend your whole ****ing life writing papers about every injustice commited in the world?


      A true Muslim moderate is one who protests desecrations of all faiths. Those who don't are not moderates but hypocrites, opportunists and agents for the rioters, merely using different means to advance the same goal: to impose upon the West, with its traditions of freedom of speech, a set of taboos that is exclusive to the Islamic faith.


      As if we didn't have our own taboos... And thanks for being commited to free speech by writing in the Washington Post. That's so consistent of you.


      These are not defenders of religion but Muslim supremacists trying to force their dictates upon the liberal West.


      People trying to 'force' their dictates by staying at home and calling for peace... Way to go, dude.
      In Soviet Russia, Fake borises YOU.

      Comment


      • #4
        Imran, agreed, and even more stupid is that most papers are afraid to print this, story that is #1 in here now (so it's a case for printing it, offensive or not), because they are afraid that someone will murder them for it. What is even more stupid is that them being afraid is also legit and not being paranoid. And if you think the reason they will not print it is because they want to be sensitive of others feelings rather than being afraid to be killed, then you are way out there in space. It's a very clear case.

        How's that for stupid?
        In da butt.
        "Do not worry if others do not understand you. Instead worry if you do not understand others." - Confucius
        THE UNDEFEATED SUPERCITIZEN w:4 t:2 l:1 (DON'T ASK!)
        "God is dead" - Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" - God.

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        • #5
          To be fair and pragmatic, there has been cases similar to this in other parts of the world as well. When Sinead O'Connor ripped the picture of the Pope, can you say bad reaction from the people? Yeah... and I bet there were more than 1 person conspirating to take some lives.
          In da butt.
          "Do not worry if others do not understand you. Instead worry if you do not understand others." - Confucius
          THE UNDEFEATED SUPERCITIZEN w:4 t:2 l:1 (DON'T ASK!)
          "God is dead" - Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" - God.

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          • #6
            And if you think the reason they will not print it is because they want to be sensitive of others feelings rather than being afraid to be killed, then you are way out there in space. It's a very clear case.


            Please Pekka, editorial pages of American newspapers have said plenty of horrible things about Muslims in the past. Saying they are afraid of the response of printing the cartoons is utterly ridiculous.

            Example:


            The Philadelphia Inquirer, a pretty big US newspaper, has printed one of the pictures.

            There have been no incidents that I've heard of in front of the Inquirer offices or to its staff.

            The NY Sun also printed a couple images. Nothing bad happened to them either.
            Last edited by Imran Siddiqui; February 10, 2006, 20:56.
            “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
            - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

            Comment


            • #7
              Now you know why nobody in my family reads Charles Krauthammer. Well, not with the intent of taking him seriously, anyway.

              The common editorials on the edge of the facing page are usually pretty decent and reasonable though.
              1011 1100
              Pyrebound--a free online serial fantasy novel

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              • #8
                So an old conservative fart living in Washington and probably not speaking a single word of Arabic knows what they think? and suddenly becomes an expert on panarabian politics?

                Is that your attempt at denying that Antisemitism is widespread and government supported in most arabic nations?

                And here's your attempt to draw attention away form that:
                Millions of injustices are commited every day, blaming someone for not standing against all of them is the most retarded thing to do. Hey dip****, here's an idea: why don't you spend your whole ****ing life writing papers about every injustice commited in the world?


                Nice try

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                • #9
                  I thought this demanded a repost.
                  Attached Files

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sirotnikov
                    Is that your attempt at denying that Antisemitism is widespread and government supported in most arabic nations?
                    Who said that?

                    And here's your attempt to draw attention away form that:

                    Millions of injustices are commited every day, blaming someone for not standing against all of them is the most retarded thing to do. Hey dip****, here's an idea: why don't you spend your whole ****ing life writing papers about every injustice commited in the world?


                    Nice try
                    Huh... a guy blames 'moderates' for not standing up against antisemitism, while having no idea of what these moderates' stance is on the issue, and then makes a sweeping generalization about them being hypocrits supporting fundamentalism?
                    I shall give back the courtesy and commend you for the nice try.
                    In Soviet Russia, Fake borises YOU.

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                    • #11
                      Imran, ahh you are right when we talk about US news papers. They aren't afraid, but many Euro papers are afraid. It's a fact.
                      In da butt.
                      "Do not worry if others do not understand you. Instead worry if you do not understand others." - Confucius
                      THE UNDEFEATED SUPERCITIZEN w:4 t:2 l:1 (DON'T ASK!)
                      "God is dead" - Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" - God.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        IIRC "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion" was written by a French clergyman.
                        "I say shoot'em all and let God sort it out in the end!

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                        • #13
                          We don't need yet another thread on this subject... post your opinions, editorials, and comments in one of the current threads...
                          Keep on Civin'
                          RIP rah, Tony Bogey & Baron O

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