How Much Calculus in High School?

[Adam Smith]

Our oldest daughter is entering middle school next year. She enjoys math and is pretty good at it. We have three options for math courses:
1. Standard sequence:
math, pre algebra, algebra, geometry, trigonometry, analysis, ending with AP calculus in 12 grade.
2. Accelerated seqeunce:
Start with pre-algebra, so everything is a year sooner. The last year is then multivariate calculus, linear algebra, or differential equations
3. Magnet Sequence:
Same as accleerated, but taught at the math / science magnet high school.

Option 3 involves a loooong commute, and therefore seems unlikely. Leaving aside the question of why on earth we have to make such a decision in fifth grade does anybody have any perspective on taking an extra year of calculus in high school? Did it help with other high school work, college admissions, or college work? Or would you rather have spent the time and effort taking more courses or more difficult (AP) courses in other subjects?

[Apocalypse]

If she isn't interested in a field that requires calculus, then it probably isn't worth it. If she wants to go LA then you'd want to try to get her to take some Statistics course most likely. I took Calculus in high school and it really didn't do much for me here since I have to take many stats classes and work with programs like SPSS.

[Jon Miller]

it helps a lot with physics or the like

for someone in 5th grade, she isnt' likely to know what she wants to do, so I would suggest putting her on that path to leave options open

if you come into college without some decent math (or have other ways of handling it) you might be forced to take 5 years to get a decent physics degree (same with some other degrees, like engineering)

Jon Miller

[Arrian]

My (fairly useless to you) perspective:

In the 5th grade I loved math. By my sophmore year of HS, I no longer liked it. By senior year (Calculus), I pretty much hated it.

Basically, tough decisions to make in 5th grade... hopefully there is the possibility of switching between those options??

-Arrian

[Pekka]

Also take it into account that once math steps up a notch, many people start to hate it. It becomes frustrating etc and many just seem to not catch up with it, because they are frustrated and won't get it fast enough (in their minds).

For someone who likes math, this is not necessarily a problem but mind you that math has been sometimes popular with girls of certain age, because they get it, but once it becomes more challenging.. it's not that they don't get it, but it becomes not the favourite subject.

So think carefully. Once you commit to it, I mean it's a waste of time unless she enjoys it or unless it's something that helps her in the future career. At this point taking it easy is something I'd recommend .. one step at a time. Then again easy math can become frustrating too, there's no challenge to it.

I guess you could go through some books, that have examples of the things that is going to be done in those courses, you know just some samples, and see if that's something she would be up to. Like read some stuff on it first, maybe she can say if she likes something better already there.

[Apocalypse]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
it helps a lot with physics or the like

for someone in 5th grade, she isnt' likely to know what she wants to do, so I would suggest putting her on that path to leave options open

if you come into college without some decent math (or have other ways of handling it) you might be forced to take 5 years to get a decent physics degree (same with some other degrees, like engineering)

Jon Miller

Well if the school ends up having an AP statistics class, then it could be choosen over Calc. So the choice really wouldn't have to be made until the senior year anyway.

[Az]

If you ask me I wish I had more calc in highschool.

The answer for me is "As much as posssible".

If she's going for a career in science, or engineering, I think it's going to benefit her, immensly.

[Jon Miller]

but that still suggests starting with prealgebra...

then she will have two years of decent math, instead of just one..

Jon Miller

[Japher]

math is the basis for a lot of other fields

imo, the more of it the better

if she likes it encourage it, but don't force it on her

if she stops liking it, their is no reason not to slow down

[Pekka]

Az, I disagree. Well not completely but most people I work with never were math freaks at early age. Most bloomed later on when they took interest in it, year before Uni or so. I never was good at math early, because it wasn't interesting to me at the time. What I'm saying is, that those who studied dilligently didn't make it most of the times and those who just came in to wing it, did make it. It's in you or it isn't. Studying it at early age doesn't make much difference.

Of course good base helps a lot, but if you have lots of difficulties with basic things, math is not something that's meant for you, it's not one of those champion stories where you read all night long every day and make it. I mean, when it steps up some notches that is.

[Jon Miller]

also, if you start with prealgrebra, and she wants to do something that is entirely nonmath related, then you can (After AP calc) skip math the senior year and take an AP (or the like) in something she finds more interesting

as long as she isn't overworked.. there is no reason to take the easier classes

often times the work ammount is the same.. it is just that she will be more bored.. and will have less options down the road

Jon Miller

[Arrian]

We're talking about a... 10 year old here, right?

-Arrian

[loinburger]

I took both multivariate calculus and differential equations in high school at the local community college, and it helped me with my computer science coursework later on -- even though we were mostly doing fake math in my numerical analysis and computational science courses (implementing a Gear or Runge-Kutta algorithm is much different than analytically solving a differential equation, and implementing a quadrature algorithm is much different than analytically solving an integral), but knowing the math behind the algorithms gave me an edge over the other students in the courses.

Plus, getting my math requirements out of the way in high school let me take more "just for fun" classes in college, whereas in high school the only "just for fun" class offered were creative writing and analysis of films.

[Jon Miller]

I know that I was bored silly, until I skipped a grade (and I was often bored after that)

it isn't a good place to be in, and a lot of students who are bored silly get into trouble

now it isn't good to work you kid super hard, but a decent ammount of work does more good then harm, I think

Jon Miller

[Jon Miller]

if your daughter ends up doing science/engineering/math, she will be glad that she took the more accelerated course

JM